Healing...and apology!

Sorry to drag this issue out of the dirt again, but I’ve looked and have yet to find a definative answer. Members, new from other forums and BP vets search the web for curiosities and answers, so maybe someone found something…? When a lig, tendon, or fibrous connective tissue is damaged as in micro-trauma, what is the time period (variable?) and nature of the healing process? Wondered for a while if it’s actually beneficial to PE before some of these tissues are actually fully healed. Theorectically, if they are fully healed would they (the abovementioned tissues) heal back to the same size, only slightly stronger than before? Or are they likely to heal at there “damage length” and essentially mimic a growth effect? Strange to me that science can tell us the elapsed time of cell division in a pant cell, but it’s hard to find this level of scrutiny in a srained ankle or stretched dick. As always, anyone feel free… groa

I’m not going to add anything new, but mention comments I’m sure are common to many.

One concensus is that not giving the lig/tendon time to heal is what allows for the growth ie. maintaining the ‘stretch’ for as long as possible and making impossible for the ‘healing’ as such to revert the tissue to its original state. Some argue that this is way BIB had great success - hanging for periods of up to 9 hours I believe. I can’t remember BIB’s opinon on that thought.

And even on Hubbard’s site, it is mentioned that the ‘formula’ as such for better growth has not been scientifically proved. One viewpoint is increasing the weight gradually and lengthening the lig little by little, maybe in a way that an athlete/gymnast gradually becomes more flexible with time through stretching exercises. Others feel that this could be wrong, as the ligs would soon become natually stronger and a point would quickly be reached at which the weight required to make a difference would be near on physically impossible. The solution is to hang with very heavy weights from the outset and fully potentialize the stetch. A little off the point as far as actual healing is concerned, but thought I’d throw it in anyway.

Guys,

I am probably going to go off on several different tangents, so bear with me. Also, I will not be able to remember everything I wish to say, so I will amend this post by adding as I think of stuff. I am one of those who, if I do not write something down or type it, it is gone. At least for a while.

Look at the facts:

1) Generally in nature, when something is repaired, the repair is stronger than the surrounding tissues. This is true whether it is a cut in a tree, a scar, a broken bone. Whatever. So, as these fibrous, collagenous tissues heal, they probably do become somewhat stronger.

2) The first limiting factors to be overcome are the shortest fibers. Then comes the next to the shortest etc.

3) After the shortest fibers fail, they are no longer the limiting factors. The next shortest are.

4) The first fibers to fail will be healing while the next limiting factors are being stressed.

5) After the first fibers are healed completely, they join with the current limiting factors. Therefore, as time goes on, more and more fibers are taking the stress at the same time.

Ex. Say you start hanging 5 lbs. Then assume the first limiting factors are ten fibers of equal strength, and approximate length. The stress on each fiber during the first set is somewhere between 5 pounds and one half pound. If the fibers are in descending strengths, each one will get the full five pounds of stress as the previous fiber fails.

At a later time, after the ten fibers have healed, another set is begun with five pounds again. Of the previous ten fibers, five are limiting factors during this set. Plus there is an additional ten fibers of the same length. So now the stresses are divided between the fifteen fibers, rather than ten. So the stress applied will be somewhere between five pounds and one-third pound per fiber, depending upon their length and strength.

This goes on set after set. Soon, you are dealing with a bundle of similar fibers as the limiting factors, equally dividing the stress among them. Plateaus? You bet.

6) The more stress applied at any one time, the more limiting factors will be broken through.

Ex. Say you hang ten pounds during a twenty minute set. You will break through all the one-pound, two pound, three pound limiting factors. Maybe the fours and fives. You will not break through any tens unless there is only one.

If you hang twenty, you will break through the ones through tens, maybe up to the twelve’s. But not the twenty unless there is only one.

7) You may have short fibers with high relative stress loads, and longer fibers with low relative stress loads. As the tougher, shorter fibers fail; the next fibers may be easier and require less stress to fail.

8) If you have a set of limiting factors, each with a five pound stress load. Then you have many longer fibers behind those (slightly longer) with only a one pound stress load each (defect), when the last of the five pound LFs give way, you will get a tear or rip as all the one pounders fail at the same time.

9) The body gives signals when the healing process has begun. It is called soreness. For the most part, when the soreness has ended, the healing has ended also.

10) Pain is an indication of severe tissue failure.

11) The amount of stress required to continue a stretch upon failed tissue is not as great as the amount of stress required to cause the failure. See #7 above.

Enough for now. Will add to later. Anybody getting a picture?

Bigger

And I was worried that this place was going to become a “hey I grew my cock 3 inches in a month” type forum.

As clear as can be, Bib, thanks! Kind of like suspension bridge failure in slow motion.

You touched on this a while back at the EZ’s and when I read it, I wasn’t really thinking of the healing issue much at the time. Flat out missed it. Point 4 is what I was curious about most of all in realtion to frequency and the healing process. Hypothetically, in point four, if the healing process of the first fibers was completely healed (assuming stronger) before the next limiting factor was stressed, would result possibly be the same or near the same failure threshold for both first and next limiting factors? I know that’s an “If Jill had 3 apples and John ate..” type of question and if you read fear into it, your right. I can think of a few different scenarios, one of which is one can up the work load significantly in terms of failure thresholds depending on the strength, length, and compostion of these fibers in a lig. I’d hate to strengthen a plataue if that’s even possible. Or is it just “double” the number (first healed + what would have been next limiting) of fibers failing at the same time? Possible the first if completely healed could become very strong resulting in failure elsewhere next session, as a result of the change in strength from healing? It’s this sort of concern that pushed me toward high frequency mode on the ligs/hanging for in some ways, I’m uneasy about healing completely in between sessions. I going to read the priciples above many times…on different days I see more and different points in the same piece of prose. Learning by confusing myself:) I’ll cut it out…until tomorrow or the next day, anyway. groa

Continued.

12) Unless a failed fiber is very short, only a small area where the failure occured should become stronger. While the failed segment of the fiber was the ‘weakest link’, it may not be anymore. Another area of the this fiber will probably become the weakest link. Therefore, the failure load of this particular fiber may not be much greater than before the original failure. The fiber will be stronger, but only as strong as the next weakest segment.

A broken bone does not become stronger along it’s entire length. Only the area of the break. If a similar action on the bone results in another break, it will probably be somewhere else.

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Questions for the board:

How sore are you after a workout? Describe.

How long after a typical workout are you sore?

What areas are sore? Skin, shaft, ligs (top, sides), internally.

Have you experienced an acute pain from PE? Describe.

Ever a chronic pain or extreme soreness after PE?

More later.

Bigger

Hopefully, tomorrow I will get to the meat of this thing.

13) Failed fibers have a much greater opportunity to heal in the elongated state if a stress remains on the fiber. Under a frequent stress, there would be little if any opportunity for adhesions to form within crenellations of the fiber. Further, any adhesions formed between periods of stress will be broken easier, with less stress, the quicker the next stress is applied. Conversely, the longer the period between stresses, the easier for adhesions to form. Also, see #11 above.

14) Any lateral stress upon a fixed longitudinal stress will increase the total stress exponentially. This can lead to a tearing or ripping of tissues. Twisting or bending while under a stretch should be avoided.

15) Almost any bodily tissue can be custom formed to heal or grow in the desired manner: i.e. traction, casts, braces, various tribal ‘enhancements’ (lips, earlobes, necks, feet binding), limb lengthening.

16) Once the tissues are formed in the desired manner, they do not return to their previous state.

17) The failure of any individual fiber is not dependant upon time. A static fiber with a ten-pound load capacity, if unchanged, can hold ten pounds forever. If the same fiber is given an eleven-pound stress, it will fail immediately.

18) The failure of each individual fiber within an assortment of fibers is dependant upon time. Each fiber failing when given the opportunity by a marginal load, and the failure of the preceding limiting factor.

19) Blood vessels will stretch easily. They will also grow as needed, or in reaction to a stress.

20) Nerves will grow and remain functional as long as the ends of any stress or break are not too far apart.

Bigger

I’ve waited a while to post this question, as I wanted to read up a little more (on EZboard etc.) Although couldn’t find all the threads (the search engine leaves alot to be desired) one interesting thread was:

There was another thread in which Dance mentioned to begin with the heaviest weights possible (unless I misunderstood). EDIT: Quote”Plenty of people make the mistake of starting with lower weights and then maxing out at the end. This is the opposite of what should be done. Start with max and lower the weight when you can’t stand it. With the Bib and a new hanging routine then you should totally work on length if that is what you want. ”
Was this for each set, when one begins hanging (newbie), or at the beginning of each session.

From what BIB posted above, to my understanding it would seem advisable to start with heavy weights, to break through all those lower fiber capacities from the outset, reduce the weight as necessary and continue hanging. And as Dance mentions, just keep hanging provided that the fatigue permits (ie no unnecessary rest days).

If I am currently hanging 5kg (11lbs), having gradually increased from 1kg (2.2lbs), with the purpose of ‘learning’ how to hang, and not suffering from noticeable soreness, should I just jump up to 15 or even 20lbs, decreasing the weight with each set as fatigue/soreness sets in? I haven’t experienced any noticeable gain in EL, nor was I expecting too (only been a couple of months now).

Guiri,

Well, I was going to try to get back to this ASAP, and I will, but I wanted to respond to your question a little while my finger is not bleeding (bandage off, lookout)

You have been hanging a while and should know what you are about. 11 poounds is pretty good, but if you are not feeling very sore after your work, you can move up slowly.

I will not lie and say I never moved up five pounds at a time. But you must understand, I was working on new and different hangers almost constantly. Many times, my max weight was limited by skin pain, head pain, or something else not associated with the work I was looking for.

So when an idea worked with a hanger, and it became more comfortable, I would move up in weight. Actually my max weight was not the max as defined by my tunica or ligs. So, these jumps were not ‘real’.

Nobody knows your body like you do. You may try an extra pound or two. If you are not sore then add another. Just be careful and be sure as you move up, to tighten the hanger a little more each time.

Bigger

Bib, I’m a patient man. Look after your finger.

Well, I am an idiot. First, I apologize for not writing more in this section. Got busy and it just slipped my mind.

Then, a few times, I wanted to put something in this thread and could not find it. Really stupid, I know. Set my thingy to see all the threads one time. Still could not find it. Finally today, I realized there are two pages of threads. I can’t believe in such a short time there are this many posts.

Anyway, Thunder if there are more idiots out there like me, you might want to put some instructions somewhere on finding all the posts. Of course, I could be the only one.

So now, I can’t remember what I wanted to post here. Alzhiemers here we come.

I hope this post will put this thread at the top so when/if I remember, I can find it quickly.

Bigger

Bigger,
Don’t feel bad, I’ve lost this post twice myself. I about went crazy trying to find it the first time. Was ready to start yelling troll. I find it now by remembering Groa started it, seems to help me narrow down the search. Speaking of search, the search function on this forum is awesome once you get familiar with using it.

The thingy Bigger is referring to is, I think, in the UserCP under Edit Options. Scroll down to the Default Thread View and use the drop down menu to select your setting.

Hell, I remember now. Only took a few days etc. Also, it has only been a few months since I said I would get to the meat of the thing.

Well, first you have to remember what the meat is. Then, you have to go find the meat.

21) Girth. Everyone wants girth. But maybe you should hold off a minute. First, figure out where you wish to be when finished with PE. Then, try to get your desired length. How come?

Common sense. In general, the larger anything is, the harder it is to stretch. Two cables of the same material and different diameters. The thicker one will be much stronger and resist stress better.

Now, some say the inner spaces of the chambers just get bigger when girth increases. Horsefeathers. I have more meat. The flaccid girth is much larger now that prePE. So, if I had gained my girth first, before length, I think the length would have been much tougher to get. Of course, this has nothing to do with ligament stretch. Only the tunica and soft tissues would be involved in the girth issue.

Further, I think that guys with larger girth to begin have a tougher time gaining length. Guys with thinner girth to begin have a much easier time gaining length. All of this is in general.

An increase in girth only requires an internal pressure above the marginal stretch. It does not really matter what the length is. Short or long, only good internal pressure is needed. Therefore, try to gain your length first.

It would be nice if guys would put up all their numbers including starting flaccid etc. Be nice to get an idea so that newbies would know what they were in for. Not enough results. Good or bad.

Bigger

Bib,

Nice insight, haven’t thought about that :( Been getting nice
girth gains, without doing any stretches at all.
I thought of it like this, the jelq mostly stretches the tunica, so when I’d start hanging seriously it would be easier to get length as only the ligs would be needed to stretch.

PEnister

PEnister,

I see what you mean. But you may be missing one point.

One of the good things about hanging is the affect on the entire groin area. IOW, the level of stress is not just on the ligs or tunica, or internal structures etc, but rather on the entire package, including internal anchor points.

It is the ultimate in multi-tasking. You may not get gains in one area, but do get gains in another. So if you hang after milking or something else, you may be plowing old ground.

Just a thought,

Bigger