Prevention of Turtling

And when will a rubber balloon be so hard as my dick?

I actually think his theory is logical.

Yes it is logical if the penis’ expansion pattern is very similar to one of a rubber balloon.

Kountrykarl, why are you trying to disprove something in theory that is already proven to work in practice?

When was not turtling proven to promote growth? I must have missed that.

It’s quite easy for people to assume causality, without some sort of rigorous trial there is no way to prove anything.

I personally think this theory does not promote ANY erect gains, and even flaccid gains seem temporary. ADS is another issue - I am talking about preventing turtling by maintaining the penis at a length and girth that is NOT its maximum - limiting the range with which it can grow and shrink. Once you bring it to its maximum, then you can be looking for gains, and that would be an ADS.

I don’t know what are you trying to say exactly, but Kountrykarl is saying that using ADS has no point and I’m disagreeing with him. Using an ADS or extender has worked for a lot of people, me included. Kountrykarl can talk about theory all he wants, but when something is shown to be effective in practice then that’s that.

You may need to reread his post. The majority of it was directed to the TOPIC of this thread, turtling and the usefulness of preventing this. The only part he wrote about ADS in his original post is:

This is an opinion, admitting that “they do something,” and explaining his opinion as it being silly because of the hours necessary to use it. Nothing wrong with his opinion: he did not state that ADS do not cause gains or argue about “practice and theory.” How did he try to disprove the effects ADS have had on penis size? He cleared admitted “they do something.” Where is the disproving, theory, and practice? You lost me.

Excellent original post Kountrykarl. As for the later ones stressing optimizing the cardiovascular health and simply exposing the inner penis, I think you may be wrong. I cannot imagine that people have not deformed or enlarged the tunica itself; this does not make sense as we have witnessed poor erectile quality (blood issues) on people with enlarged penises from PE.

Must’ve misread then, sorry. :)

I’ve noticed this was as well lately. However, I most notice this only after sex, not masturbation. Haven’t clamped yet though, a few more months for that.

I agree with the poster above, this theory is quote logical. From my brief time on here, I’ve found one major theory on growth: cell division/cell creation. However, this seems far more logical. With regards to turtling, there is a tremendous amount of anecdotal evidence that the prevention of turtling leads to growth. This is indisputable no matter how logical the theory. However, I DO think it’d be fair to say that your theory of growth (chamber expansion) is possible/likely to be true. In fact, this is the premise that clamping functions on, so we know for certain that expansion causes girth growth. At a glance, expansion doesn’t explain length gains, but your vacuum analogy is persuasive in find that it does cause length.

Except balloons don’t have circulating fibroblasts to heal damaged tissue and collagen fibre to restrengthen the damaged tissue.

I haven’t experienced the penis pump, but i know that your penis doesn’t get twice as large as a normal erection unless, again, it is an issue of erection quality. Also, penis pump may increase size by pulling fluid into regions outside the tunica. I don’t think the inner penis can really grow significantly with just one use of the pump. Does anyone else agree with me here, or am I not making sense?

exactly. Simple analogies of plumbing, rubber, creep. etc do not apply at all human tissue and is not nearly as intuitive as many people here try to make it out to be. Tissue has a response to stress that is not exhibited by any nonliving substance. Repeated stretching of human tissue, if done too intensely, results in toughening and loss of elasticity, not weakening. A PE session may temporarily damage the tissue, but the end result of the tissue response is some combination of the following depending on the exercises, intensity, duration, and other factors. The immediate response may be cell damage/death, stretching of the collagen matrix. Hours later, cells may begin to divide, restructure the extracellular matrix, secreting collagen to repair the damage and possibly reducing the ratio of elastin to collagen in the tissue. Basically the composition of the tissue changes. If you do it right and don’t overtrain, cells may grow and divide to meet the demand of the tissue restructuring and maintenance that is taking place.

I am starting to realize the importance of intensity thresholds, technique, etc. in the response of penile tissue. Much like yoga is able to stretch and lengthen the ligaments over time, PE, if done slowly can stretch the penile tissue. If done too intensely, the tissue will have a response that makes it less prone to growth, which is why overtraining is to be avoided and why deconditioning breaks are effective.

As far as an ADS is concerned, there are plenty of scientific articles that suggest static stress causes cell division and tissue growth. There are plenty of practical instances here that show this may also be true of the penile tissue.

Personally I don’t think you can even liken the response of collagen fibres like the tunica to ligs, since ligs are actually designed to stretch.

It almost seems like he was trolling.

Good point.