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Ever heard of the BRAVA System?

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Originally Posted by Shiver
Sparkyx, I think you might be interested in reading the Dr Kevin Pezzi book “Advanced Enlargement”. His advice was that if someone were to try this, then to go no higher than 30mmHG, and pointed out that capillary closure pressure is around 27-32mmHg (varies between individuals, health and activities), which you’d want to stay below if doing something like this passively.

Interesting 30 mm hg converts to 1.18 in hg!

That sounds about right to me.

Happiness begins where selfishness ends!

Physiologic Indicators for Growth (PI's) Force Thresholds

Erectile Quality Thread (EQ) Is Less,More?

Originally Posted by tinytim
I don’t think that is a good idea. Keeping your penis is a vacuum all night can cause blood clots. Take it from me, its happend to me and it ain’t pretty. You need to allow circulation i.e. regular frequent breaks from the vacuum. Maybe the low pressure might allow enough circulation, but if it does not you will be in a world of hurt. Swelling, pain, infection, possible permanent damage, or worse - amputation. Do you feel Lucky?

Well, when you put it that way…no.

Tell me what you did? What vacuum and for how long?

Maybe keeping it below 1 in hg would bypass the effect. When I have tried 1 in hg, it doesn’t seem to interfer with circulation at all.

Happiness begins where selfishness ends!

Physiologic Indicators for Growth (PI's) Force Thresholds

Erectile Quality Thread (EQ) Is Less,More?

Xaxxat,

Excellent catch on the digital vacuum sensor. Definitely going to check that out. Perhaps match with existing gauge on Kaplan.

Thanks.

Originally Posted by hgte74
Xaxxat,

Excellent catch on the digital vacuum sensor. Definitely going to check that out. Perhaps match with existing gauge on Kaplan.

Thanks.

You betcha. Since it has a digital output ( I assume 0-5 volts) it could be used to drive a relay to control an electric pump. That should minimize any leakage. Or, it could just be used as a monitor for a manual pump. It does look sweet…

Originally Posted by Shiver
While I understand and accept your point regarding the different tissue design and strengths, I think it’s important to consider that what we’d be doing here is not overcoming the mechanical strength of any tissues. The stress would be tiny. The idea of this method is fundamentally different to conventional PE in that the latter has a program of “I’ve damaged this tissue, now go repair it body please”. Where there’s life, there’s will, and by altering the programming on a cellular level (by environmental change triggering adaptation), growth could be possible without any trauma or damage. It’s all locked up in that DNA, it just needs are reason to wake up. That applies to skin, bone, connective tissue, liver, even the brain! Well, maybe not everyones brain :D But the point is that all tissue structures are made by design, and the stimulus to remodel that design doesn’t require brute force, but impetus.

This is the big question, isn’t it? Does the penis grow through plastic deformation or from some biochemical process induced by, among other things, tension on the tissues.

I hope you won’t mind me switching sides in this argument for moment. I like your idea and believe it or not was secretly hoping you would respond as you did :D .

I am fairly certain that my newbie gains (0.5” BPEL) were NOT attributable to plastic deformation. I simply wasn’t pulling that hard. And yet those are my best gains to date, even though I’ve since hung over 25# from my dick for hours each day.

One theory for why gentle tension might work is that it holds tissues in an extended (or inflated) state for such very long periods of time that the tissues are caused to REMODEL in the extended/inflated state. You can think of this like stretching a thick rubber band, and then over time replacing bits of the stretched rubber with smaller unstretched segments. Eventually, the entire rubber band will be replaced by enough unstretched segments that the structure, as a whole, can be stretched further than it originally could have been. This is another way of saying the overall size is increased.

Note that this is different from the ADS idea. The justification for ADS is that microtears need to be kept open so they can be “filled in” with new tissue instead of closing. Here, we’re saying that no tissue trauma (micro-tears) need occur. Perhaps normal tissue turnover will do the job for you if you can keep the tissue under light tension for a very large fraction of each day.

Enter your measurements in the PE Database.

Last edited by ModestoMan : 09-12-2005 at .

There is so much in the Pezzi book that I want to write out, but for the sake of completion I feel I’d have to write the whole thing out which obviously isn’t practical.

The book results aren’t thoroughly tested, or even verified, though I do currently believe there is some mileage to be had (basically tiny stress, massive hours).

Originally Posted by sparkyx
There have been procedures where they insert steel rods into leg bones and slowly apply pressure to extend the length…and it works.

It does work, but they have to break the bone first. The broken bone is allowed to heal until a “soft callus” is formed. The soft callus consists of collagen and other connective tissue stuff but is not mineralized.

Then the distractor is applied. Importantly, distraction only works in this soft callus state. Once the bone mineralizes, no further growth can occur.

Check out this thread, which goes into bone lengthening in detail.

Originally Posted by sparkyx
The collagan, ligaments, muscle, nerves,blood vessels, well …just about everything in the leg has to lengthen along with the bone.

I think there are few tissues in the human frame that doesn’t respond to slow steady pressure, either pulling or compression…thats out of necessity.

That’s the big question: Do all tissues lengthen by the same amount? Tendons and ligaments may be particularly resistant. Softer tissues are easier to stretch.

I think one of the posts in the thread I linked to above says that tendons and ligaments are cut during limb distraction and reattached afterwards. Not a good piece of information from our point of view.

Originally Posted by sparkyx
In penis enlargement I think we have two major ways of expanding the tissue.

One is frank force, enough to overcome the inherent integrity of the tissue. Force that exceeds the tissues ability to maintain its present proportions. Deformation force.

Two, a much milder force that causes stimulation of cellular changes. I think that the BRAVA system is in this category. (personally I feel this category can lead to the greatest AMOUNT of change.)

I think a really successful pe program can use the best of these two and produce fairly sustained expansion over a period of time.

Sounds reasonable to me, in theory at least.

I think that different guys respond differently to “plastic deformation.” I’m thinking not only of myself here but also our friend Lost Guitar, who seemed to do everthing possible to overcome his body’s structural integrity and ultimately lost the fight. Whether stretched tissue grows from plastic deformation seems to depend on more than just force and tissue strength. There are also the immune system and the body’s biochemical programming to contend with.

Enter your measurements in the PE Database.

Every one knows that to get bigger breasts women need to jelq them…..everything else is just a load a croq…. :)

Originally Posted by ModestoMan

…Note that this is different from the ADS idea. The justification for ADS is that microtears need to be kept open so they can be “filled in” with new tissue instead of closing. Here, we’re saying that no tissue trauma (micro-tears) need occur. Perhaps normal tissue turnover will do the job for you if you can keep the tissue under light tension for a very large fraction of each day.

I must have misunderstood things along the way. I understand the golf rings etc as a means to keep microtears open, but JES et al talk of using their equipment solo, and the forces used are not enough to induce microtears on their own? This - except that it is pumping - would be akin to wearing golf rings all day long?

regards, mgus

Taped onto the dashboard of a car at a junkyard, I once found the following: "Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement." The car was crashed.

Primary goal: To have an EQ above average (i.e. streetsmart, compassionate about life and happy) Secondary goal: to make an anagram of my signature denoting how I feel about my gains

Originally Posted by ModestoMan
It does work, but they have to break the bone first. The broken bone is allowed to heal until a “soft callus” is formed. The soft callus consists of collagen and other connective tissue stuff but is not mineralized.

Then the distractor is applied. Importantly, distraction only works in this soft callus state. Once the bone mineralizes, no further growth can occur.

Check out this thread, which goes into bone lengthening in detail.

That’s the big question: Do all tissues lengthen by the same amount? Tendons and ligaments may be particularly resistant. Softer tissues are easier to stretch.

I think one of the posts in the thread I linked to above says that tendons and ligaments are cut during limb distraction and reattached afterwards. Not a good piece of information from our point of view.

I was refering to a study I saw on dwarfism. There was no breaking of bones or surgical reattachment. Just insertion of rods and slow steady expansive forces.

The kids I saw had gained about 6 inches.

Happiness begins where selfishness ends!

Physiologic Indicators for Growth (PI's) Force Thresholds

Erectile Quality Thread (EQ) Is Less,More?

Originally Posted by sparkyx
I was refering to a study I saw on dwarfism. There was no breaking of bones or surgical reattachment. Just insertion of rods and slow steady expansive forces.

Cool. Do you have a link.

Enter your measurements in the PE Database.

Originally Posted by Shiver

Sparkyx, I think you might be interested in reading the Dr Kevin Pezzi book “Advanced Enlargement”. His advice was that if someone were to try this, then to go no higher than 30mmHG, and pointed out that capillary closure pressure is around 27-32mmHg (varies between individuals, health and activities), which you’d want to stay below if doing something like this passively.

I was rethinking this…wouldn’t the capillarys EXPAND (hence the redness) under vacuum?

The statement above refers to pressure. Maybe he IS refering to pressure and not vacuum.

Maybe he is refering to distractive force and capillary closure.

I found that 5 lbs of wt resulted in about 3 in hg on my meter.

So maybe I should see what wt is comparable to 1 in hg and use that for ADS?

Happiness begins where selfishness ends!

Physiologic Indicators for Growth (PI's) Force Thresholds

Erectile Quality Thread (EQ) Is Less,More?

Originally Posted by mgus
I must have misunderstood things along the way. I understand the golf rings etc as a means to keep microtears open, but JES et al talk of using their equipment solo, and the forces used are not enough to induce microtears on their own? This - except that it is pumping - would be akin to wearing golf rings all day long?

I thiink that’s right, but this all assumes that low tension and low pressure pumping over long periods of time really does any good.

Enter your measurements in the PE Database.

Go to pumptoys.com they have a new pump not even out yet but they are taking orders. Computerized looks pretty damn good.

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