The Chemical PE Thread

I am writing here as one of the members partaking of what could be considered to be the first wave of chemical PE back in 2006. Driven by the proclaimed successes of some, interest in the topic rose, just to fall like the tide with the injuries and failures of others. It seems that now, especially on other sites, a growing number of men are willing to dabble in chemical PE. With this more recent surge of interest in the topic, this thread should serve as a place for objectivity to reassess previous experiences, both good and bad, and weigh the potential of chemical PE against its risks. Above all, the intent is to clear the haze of naivety of interested newcomers. In more figurative language, we haven’t yet found the Holy Grail of PE. It might be hidden somewhere in the area of chemical PE but, as sure as death, is guarded by a giant blood-lusting dragon that longs for casualties of long-lasting or worse, permanent penile injury. So this should be a thread for the discussion of promising peptides, and reviews of previous experience.

For some initial grounding on the history of the topic, here are some links:
Chemical PE Links
Chemical PE progress report
Dr. Adams Chem PE Again
My chemical adventure
My Chemical P.E. Journey
Chemical PE - DIY mixing thread
Topical Chemical PE

The Basics 01: Caverject, Alpostradil, Prostaglandin

So, let’s start from the start. The basic idea of chemical PE is derived from the treatment of erectile dysfunction (ED): to cause, that is induce, an erection by changing the equilibria of specific bodily biochemical agents. This is paired with the idea of priapism: if an erection at mostly full internal pressure which (by far) outlasts a normal erection can cause a phenomenon called megalophallus, then a more controllable erection time solely caused by chemicals constitutes an alternative way of PE. Think of it as a three to four hours long edging session that comes at the cost of injecting a precise dose of chemicals, yet at the freedom of little to no mental and physical stimulation. This is the theory in a nutshell. Doses and injections are where things start get tricky.

The medically most common means for ED treatment are either lab-assisted mixes such as bi-mix, tri-mix and quad-mix (more specifics on these in a future section) or pre-defined mixtures sold by large pharmacy companies such as Pfizer, with the most prominent under the brand name of Caverject. Whichever way chosen, it boils down to injecting a precise and specific mixture of chemical agents with pure, safe-for-injection, bacteriostatic water (or other solutions, which will be addressed more in detail later), as a solution into the penis. The main active component is the chemical Prostaglandin E-1 (PGE-1) in the form of Alpostradil. The name prostaglandin originates from its natural production location in the human body, which is the prostate gland. It should be noted that Prostaglandin E-1 is the raw chemical agent and Alpostradil is the name of the pharmaceutically refined PGE-1. The distinction between the two should not be underrated. Let me elaborate on how peptides such as PGE-1 are produced in the first place, to get a better idea of the difference.

PGE-1 and other peptides are the product of specifically cultured Escherichia Coli bacteria. As such, the raw form of PGE-1 is - in most cases - only 97% pure. The 3% impurities are mainly comprised of E.Coli bacterial residua. To make the chemical agent into a pharmaceutical grade agent requires filtering and X-ray purification. As bacteria size ranges from 0.2 to 2 microns in diameter and from 1 to 10 microns in length, a 0.2 micron filter can be used to remove most of the bacteria residua. Since the purification procedures undertaken by pharmaceutical companies are more complex than just running the PGE-1 in solvent through a filter paper, it is easy to understand why the refined outcome (Alpostradil) is sold at a much higher price point.

The Basics 02: PGE-1 - the good, the bad and the ugly

The previous section introduced prostaglandin E-1 and it’s role in chemical PE. In this section, I’d like to delve into the details and issues of this peptide hormone.

Let’s start with the good: PGE-1 is a very powerful active vasolidator, which is a chemical agent that relaxes smooth muscle cells and widens blood vessels. If dosed correctly, PGE-1 can induce those hard and ideally 3-4 hours lasting erections with strong pressure on the tunica from within. The continuous stress on the tunica with blood pressures surpassing those of a normal erection, yet without the disadvantage of mechanically clamping off oxygen supply to the Corpus Spongiosum, is one of the main benefits of such a vasolidator. Other vasolidators will be dealt with in a later section.

PGE-1 not only opens up the vessels and valves to the arteries that allow an erection to happen in the first place, it also inhibits and regulates the production of collagen. The biochemical mechanisms are not entirely clear. Various scientific studies indicate a positive effect of PGE-1 on the restructuring of highly cross-linked, collagenous tissues such as the tunica and ligaments, yet to a lesser extent than PGE-2.

Moreover, PGE-1 has a variety of other effects on hormones and receptors that to a greater or lesser extent are likely to contribute to growth. The understanding of the mechanisms and interactions at cellular level are yet incomplete. From my personal experience I can however confirm positive PIs from low to moderate doses of PGE-1, including faster built-up to an erection, stronger and longer lasting night-time erections and more engorgement in flaccid state.

The bad side of prostaglandin E1 surfaces when actually handling it in practice. There are three main issues rolled into one:

• It degrades rapidly
• Is tricky to store and
• Hard to dose correctly.

At a temperature of -20°C, PGE-1 has a shelf life of at least 2 years when kept in its original, powdery, dry state. Combined with the fact that both minuscule and precise amounts are required for a single shot, this entails a whole host of practical problems. The amounts required for a single shot are usually in the low single-digit micro-grams range. This is just about the weight in the range between a large particle of dust and a very tiny grain of sand. This makes it barely visible to the unassisted human eye, and simply impossible to weigh - absent of some high-precision analytical scales.

As both a warning and a reference to newbies: the first time you intend to inject PGE-1, I.e. Alpostradil, do not inject more than 3.0 mcg, unless guided by a doctor. Actually it is very stupid to put a needle into your penis without medical assistance at all. It’s not worth spending the majority of your first chemical PE session in a hospital, so it’s better to be highly prepared and to start with a very low dose (should you choose to take your chances). If the dose turns out to be too low, not resulting in a firm and often painful erection after at least 15 minutes or even 30 minutes, you can try and repeat the next day with a slightly increased dose. This process of evaluating your personal dose is called titration; it is among the first steps of a medically assisted chemical PE program or therapy for erectile dysfunction.

Since very few chemical PE practitioners and aspirants can call a state-of-the art analytical scale their own, in order to weigh off even a small multiple of the estimated dose of a single shot, the smallest amount of powder it is possible to reliably weigh must be used. This is then added to the solvent. Dilute this stock solution down to a ratio practicable for both short-term storage and injection. But there’s a catch: once the peptide is in solution, there is practically no way back to the freezer. Peptides, such as prostaglandins, are very sensitive to ice crystallization.

Next to the challenge of wasting precious quantities of API because more than could be used is put in solution, the question should arise: which fluid is chemically appropriate to use as solvent for stockage? In the case of PGE-1, its specification states that basic solutions (pH value > 7.4) cause degradation to PGA and PGB and should hence be avoided. In the same way, solvents based on water should be avoided due to their high potential to degrade PGE-1. This makes organic solvents, such as DMSO, an appropriate choice to reduce the speed of degradation when used as medium term stock. Do not to use solvents with high toxicity levels! Storage temperatures for stock solutions should be in the range of 2°C to 4°C to allow for only moderate degradation over a period of several months. Extracting a very small quantity from the stock solution and diluting it further down to injectable levels in a water-based (aqueous) solution such as bacteriostatic water or phosphate buffered saline (PBS) for injection purposes constitutes the most common way of handling this prostaglandin. PBS is a special form of saline with its pH-value adjusted to human blood, which reduces the burning sensation after injecting. Provided that these steps are carried out in a clean and hygienic environment, the risks associated can be contained.

In the case of Caverject (and others), the included quantity of PGE-1 is in a stabilized form as a result of extensive freeze-drying treatment (U.S. Pat. Nos. 3,952,004 and 3,927,197), which would save most of the hassle mentioned above.

Injection of prostaglandin E1 is pain. Unlike normal erections, those induced by PGE-1 may cause discomfort to unbearable pain. Generally speaking, the higher the dosage of PGE-1 and thus the longer the induced erection lasts, the higher the pain factor, and the soreness resulting from it.

But there are other problems with PGE-1. The results of a follow-up study suggest that large doses of PGE-1 over long treatment periods is likely to cause fibrosis and to some extent even penile curvature. Penile fibrosis (PF) appears to be correlated with the cumulated amount of PGE-1 used over the treatment period, as patients with lower PGE-1 doses were either less prone to develop PF or more likely to recover from their fibrotic changes. The influence of PGE-1 on the development of PF is still unclear and conjectural at best. The main cause for fibrosis appears to be in the method of administration, injection, and thus the perforation of skin and tunica. Other studies however suggest the beneficial effects of PGE-1 to the healing of PF in the case of Peyronie’s disease.

Summing up, PGE-1 and its API Alpostradil is a peptide hormone, and in its function as a vasolidator is of great interest to PE. It has various known, indicated and unknown beneficial effects but also many disadvantages and risks. The bodily reaction to this chemical agent may vary from individual to individual, including hormonal balance and systemic influences just like side-effects from other drugs. Lastly and unfortunately, applying this peptide leaves no practicable alternatives to injections with present-day medical methods.

Further Reading

Prostaglandin E1 in erectile dysfunction. Efficiency and incidence of priapism - PubMed
http://www.natu re.com/ki/journ … ki1996302a.html

The effects of PGE1 and PGE2 on in vitro myometrial contractility and uterine structure - PMC
http://onlineli brary.wiley.com … 05.05499.x/full
PGE1 suppresses the induction of collagen synthesis by transforming growth factor-beta 1 in human corpus cavernosum smooth muscle - PubMed
Effects of a collagen matrix containing prostaglandin E(1) on wound contraction - PubMed
http://www.natu re.com/ijir/jou … l/3900951a.html
http://www.aian … na.org/node/334

The Basics 03: Handling and Storage

As a general notion, chemical PE is above all a matter of diligence and accuracy. This starts with the work space used to fabricate and mix solutions, prepare shots, manage storage, etc. It should be well-lit and sanitized before each and every use. I have two bottles of hygiene spray for that purpose.

Another issue is hand hygiene. Hands should be thoroughly washed and sanitized before touching equipment such as vials, filters, bottles or syringes. Medical gloves (unused, non-returnable) are optional as long as there is no direct contact with the chemicals in use.

As detailed previously, PGE-1 is a rather sensitive peptide and should hence be stored with care. Whereas the long-term stash in its powdery state requires temperatures at about -20°C, in stock solution temperatures around 0°C to 4°C are required. Practically, the vials with powder go into a freezer and the vials with solution into a refrigerator. Modern freezers are built to maintain their contents at a temperature of about -10°C down to -25°C with ease, so the storage of dry PGE-1 over a period of up to a few years shouldn’t be an issue. Even the freezing compartment of a good refrigerator can sustain temperatures of about -18°C, which comes sufficiently close to the target. In contrast to these sub-zero temperatures, the stock solution should be kept just above the freezing point of the solvent, which has its own problems: microbes, spores and other unwanted germs thrive in a non-freezing environment such as a domestic central food storage facility, I.e. Your personal fridge. The question how to sustain a sufficient level of hygiene is one of both costs and effort. Ideally, a separate cooling instance is used for the stock solution and the short-term aqueous solution; a small hotel room fridge appears appropriate for that purpose. The less-costly, not-so-ideal and higher-effort alternative is to store the solution(s) in the domestic refrigerator; obviously not next to old cheese and rotten vegetables, and especially not in close proximity to the refrigerator drain, where germ concentrations are the highest. A practical way of handling peptide storage in co-habitat with groceries is to spare a separate compartment in the refrigerator (yes, an entire compartment!) , and in addition encase the vials in a Russian doll like manner. With meticulous regularity, the refrigerator should be cleaned and its peptide compartment disinfected with hygiene spray. I recommend packing the vials in an airtight zipper bag within an airtight zipper bag within an airtight and easy to clean container, such as a sealed Tupperware lunchbox. Each containment has to be made airtight before and after each use of its contents.

Replace the zipper bags and disinfect the airtight lunch box(es) with the same meticulous regularity, I.e. At least on a weekly basis. The fridge should be set to a very low temperature setting, just high enough to prevent the solution(s) from freezing. I recommend placing a thermometer next to the peptide encasement to control the temperature. Fine adjustments can be made by positioning the peptides further to the front of the refrigerator, for a temperature increase, or closer to the rear, for lower temperatures. So, take your time, prepare each step well, and never underestimate the risk of infection and blood poisoning!

The Basics 04: Injections - a means of drug delivery

If there was one common thing, which every regularly intelligent being on this planet would hate, or at least strongly prefer to do without, it would be injections. This is for a good reason: the skin as a vital part of the organism is damaged, signalled by pain. And, until fully healed, its main functioning bypassed, which is that of a physicochemical barrier, namely the protection from adverse outer influences such as germs, or just about anything non-beneficial and likely dangerous to the organism. If there was any other way of medical administration of a necessary drug, most of us would surely choose the alternative to an injection syringe.

The arguments for this least pleasant way of medical administration can be brought down to its bypassing capabilities, accuracy, and with it, dose efficiency. In contrast to ingestion, I.e. Oral medication, injections bypass the entire digestive tract with its gastric juices, sufficiently acid to break down and disable sensitive chemical compounds. In contrast to topical administration including areas with very thin skin such as beneath the tongue, the genitals and the rectum, injections benefit from higher accuracy and the limits of trans-dermal diffusion. Varying to some extent by individual factors such as skin structure, but also temperature, the capability of a chemical, especially a complex molecule to penetrate the skin is limited by its molecular weight (MW).

There is no precise limit, but as a rule of thumb, the “500 Dalton rule” establishes that the molecular weight of a chemical compound must be at or below 500 Dalton to penetrate the skin, with other authors mentioning even 1000 Dalton as upper limit (a future section on the possibilities of trans-dermal applications will follow). Unimpaired by the limits of trans-dermal penetration, injections moreover allow the deployment of chemicals to a rather precise target area, thus enabling even short-lived peptides to readily attach to suitable receptors in the local tissue, with no or only very little effect on other organs.

An ideal local injection would be dosed and placed in the way that close to none of the chemical leaves the target tissue. This would allow a very high dose efficiency with minimal side-effects. In the case of intra-organic injections, intramuscular injections and even more so injections into the CC, which by an erection is sealed off to an almost closed vessel, accuracy to the organ level is inherent and can be used to great benefit. Consider that the decisive factor of what an API may achieve after docking to appropriate receptors, is the amount of its molecules per volume unit of blood (usually measured in ng/ml, that is nanograms per milliliter). Minimizing the potential volume of blood and cells supplied with blood which the API is diluted and dispersed to thus maximizes the efficiency of its dosage. So injections not only bypass barriers, which strongly reduce the amount of a chemical that enters the body, they may also be used to target tissues with high precision and in the case of the CC without diluting the chemical agent further down as it spreads systemically via the blood flow.

Due to varying individual and external factors, specifics of the chemical compound as well as delivery-enhancing chemicals, there is no constant ratio that could give a precise idea of how much more of a chemical is needed in any of the present alternatives to an injection. In the example of PGE-1, studies suggest a factor of 64 to 128 at which the dose needs to be increased for trans-urethal application in the stead of intracavernosal injection. On a further note, my personal experience is that trans-urethal application of alpostradil does not yield reliable results at all. More resistant barriers of the organism, mainly upper dermis and digestive tract, are likely to increase this rough estimate by another magnitude, given the molecules manage to pass the barrier in the first place.

Further reading:

• The 500 Dalton rule for the skin penetration of chemical compounds and drugs - PubMed
• Treatment of Men with Erectile Dysfunction with Transurethral Alprostadil | NEJM

This is a very technical thread. I hope that anyone considering this route reads it.

There are a couple of obvious questions. To avoid overdosing on PGE-1 you talk about mixing an intermediate mixture using the smallest weighable amount. Scales are tricky things and you don’t mention tolerance levels. If a scale has a tolerance level of +-.25g and you intend to weigh 1g, you might end up with as much as 1.25g (25%) extra. Given the nature of problems involved in measurement, what is the most accurate approach?

How can one tell whether ones mixture has become tainted or is safe to inject? Are there any signs or is it simply a matter of keeping the best hygiene levels possible and hoping?

I know you intend to write some more on injections but self injecting a home made mixture seems to present a few challenges, not least the potential for anguish about whether this time you injected a clean mixture with an appropriate dose. It’s hard to quantify risk but is there potential for another delivery mechanism?

Thanks for your work on this, I learned a lot.

Thanks for asking ;)

Writing "the smallest weighable amount" I meant what you get in a single vial, which is usually 1mg, unless ordering bulk amounts like 5g (#1). If this 1mg is reconstituted with 2ml DMSO, 1ml solution now has 500mcg and 1/10th of that has 50mcg. This tenth of a 1ml syringe of stock solution with now 50mcg of PGE-1 is plenty to be further diluted for the weekly stock (#2). Discharge these 50mcg from the syringe into a rubber-stoppered glass vial and another 2ml of either bacteriostatic water, or preferably PBS, and the new solution used as weekly stock is now down to 25mcg PGE-1 per ml. If 1/10th of that weekly stock is extracted with a syringe, this 1/10th of a 1ml syringe (10 iu on the scale of most syringes) now contains 2.5mcg of PGE-1. This is about the maximum dose I would recommend for a starter. The syringe could now be filled up with bacteriostatic water or PBS, preferrably till it is filled to at least half a millilitre.
So, the most accurate approach is to not touch the dry API at all, to be more precise, not even remove a single rubber-stopper from a vial (which is also the most hygienic way to deal with injectables). Instead, use solutions like a pure organic solution for the stock and a water-based solution for the weekly stock to get down to those fine-grained doses in the micrograms.

It can happen that a solution turns bad. It never happened to me, but in forums I read about solutions with parts that solidify, or clog together to a jelly substance. In glass vials, this is easily detected. My recommendation is to prepare a new solution and dispose of the bad one. Alternatively, run the solution through a 0.2micron filter. As long as the environment is hygienic, the worst thing that could happen is a loss of API potency.

As for delivery mechanisms, I do see more potential on the nano-scale. At least since the discovery and development of Fullerenes in the 80’s. Classic Fullerenes are simply said another structural form of pure carbon (next to graphite, graphene and diamond), and to be more precise structures of carbon-atoms linked together 3-dimensionally to form a hollow sphere. The idea has prevailed to one day be able to fill up similar carbon hollow-shapes with specific drugs and use these for precise drug delivery. There are various technical options when combining such a carbon hollow sphere with magnetic particles, nano-scale impellents, release and guiding systems. As long as the dose stays in the micrograms, such delivery vehicles could be made small enough to make it through the digestive system intact, and find their way through the blood-flow to their target.

Further reading on that topic:
Unique nano carrier targets drug delivery to cancer cells
Microencapsulation produces uniform drug release vehicle

===
#1) you can get good prices on bulk amounts of alpostradil, which at some point it might even be necesssary to have large quantity
#2) as a good estimate for starters; doses rise close to exponentially the longer a chemical PE protocol as this is followed

For an additional cost ($78), I get 8 ml of Trimix containing 5.88 mcg/ml of PGE-1,which has been prepared by an approved compounding pharmacy which also includes Papaverine (18 mg/ml) and Phentolamine (.6 mg/ml). I am assured of a clean mix and, with the addition of the two other ingredients, the effects are increased, the pain from PGE-1 is almost eliminated and the risk of fibrosis is significantly reduced. However, you will need a prescription.

Good you mention Trimix prepared by a compounding pharmacy for a good price. A urologist-guided programme with prescribed bimix, trimix or quadmix is the save way to start into chemical PE. At some point, you might want to add APIs that enhance the delinking of collagen on one side, and APIs that spur the growth of smooth muscle on the other. Approved ;)

Does not diluting the PGE1 (i.e. by using trimix instead of 100% PGE1) reduce the collagen softening effect? From the perspective of softening the tunica so it can be enlarged, do you not want to use as much PGE1 as possible?

This effect of tunica softening and de-linking collagen as you refer to, marks the point where opinions on PGE-1 diverge. Practitioners of chemical PE in other forums claim this is the reason for the strong pain that follows an injection of PGE-1, not the strong expansion itself. This view follows the ‘no pain, no gain’ paradigm. Obviously, with other vasolidators which induce an erection but not the pain and soreness as experienced with PGE-1, the effect on collagen remodeling would not be present. I personally see not enough scientific evidence for this claim. There is some, but despite my personal experience with PGE-1, I wouldn’t set it as sure, but rather as indicated, e.g.: PGE1 suppresses the induction of collagen synthesis by transforming growth factor-beta 1 in human corpus cavernosum smooth muscle - PubMed

There are other chemicals, either in the acidic reign, on copper-basis, or matrix metalloproteinases (MMPs) themselves with a stronger scientific basis for their effect on collagen.

My personal point is not to use as much PGE-1 as possible, but as little as necessary to maintain a 4 hours erection. There are more and most probably less painful ways to directly target the hard and growth-hindering penile tissues.

Suppose someone who underwent psychiatric treatment at a young age. This treatment being in the form of medication and these medications raise prolactin and lowers sex steroids. I’ve had erectile dysfuntion during puberty because of these drugs. In the end, I really never had a problem to begin with, and Psychiatry can really ruin someones life if they’re not sick. It’s sad that a lot of otherwise healthy children are forced to take meds against their will. I’ve had priapism before, and I noticed it gave me better EQ than what I normally could do. I base my EQ on this really. I’m still young so I see it that the window is still open to fix my problems, which are much worse than before.

I have this theory that a window of time is still open if someone in a similar situation as me tried proven PE tactics of this category.

Hi Monster3 and thanks for writing in this thread.

I am startled to read cases as yours and even that this sort of heavy and intrusive medication can be called psychiatric treatment.

Concerning ED due to medication, my personal theory is that the hormonal balance, especially of DHT is strongly deranged. I have had a similar problem with finasteride.

Have you had your DHT and testosterone levels checked?

Hey all. Great to see a general ChemPE research thread up an going again. The old ones were interesting and it always sort of surprised me that there wasn’t really a second wave of people trying to get involved and make progress on the whole thing. I’m not at the point of trying things myself yet, but I’ve read pretty much everything related to the topic. Hopefully we can get some fulfilling discussion/research going on in here!

I’m mostly interested in things that haven’t been tried or discussed as much as the things that are commonly brought up.

So, for my first post in this thread:
Anyone have any thoughts on PGF2A and/or PGE2? I’m surprised to see that not many (if any) have tried these two compounds. My curiosity was sparked because in the patent it states:
"[0054] Preferred prostaglandins are prostaglandin F2 alpha and prostaglandin E2."

It seems these could be beneficial due to their similarities to the effects of relaxin:
"[0055] Relaxin directly and indirectly triggers a cascade of complex biochemical and cellular effects that can cause general morphological changes to genitalia. Prostaglandins such as prostaglandin F2 alpha and prostaglandin E2 have similar effects."

"48. A method as defined in claim 45, wherein the potentiator is relaxin, prostaglandin F2 alpha, or prostaglandin E2, or the biochemical mediator that results in the desired changes in collagen or the connective tissue that produces and remodels collagen and express the effects of relaxin, prostaglandin F2 alphs, or prostaglandin E2."

"[0043]A prostaglandin potentiator can be prostaglandin F2 alpha or prostaglandin E2. The potentiator might be relaxin, prostaglandin F2 alpha, or prostaglandin E2, or the biochemical mediators that result in the desired changes in collagen or the connective tissue that produces and remodels collagen and express the effects of relaxin, prostaglandin F2 alpha, or prostaglandin E2."

I haven’t seen many posts about use of PGE2, but I know that Ron posted a blog about injecting it along with PGE1. The report was somewhat uninteresting, but I think that’s because it was simply a one-time thing. I don’t know how logical or practical it would be, but I’m curious as to how much more effective a trimix of the 3 PGs would be, as opposed to injecting just 1.

As for PGF2A, it seems to have been used by bodybuilders for localized muscle growth a few years ago. From what I’ve seen, it had some interesting side effects, but some seemed to enjoyed the results they got. It can be injected or applied topically. If I’m reading things correctly, there’s PGF2a, and then there’s PGCL, it’s analogue, which is apparently much, much stronger. It’s mentioned being used as both a SubQ injection and a topical formulation in the patent:

"[0084] .. Was treated with separate intracavernosal injections of vasodilators, Papavarine, phentolamine and prostaglandin E1, on a regular basis.. Along with daily subcutaneous injections of a prostaglandin F analogue."

"[0092] .. Was treated with intracavernosal injections of .. Prostaglandin E1, Atropine, Chlorpromazine and Papavarine .. Indirect vasodilating effects of oral Cialis and Levitra were sometimes added .. Potentiators Potaba .. And prostaglandin F topically were also used."

I don’t know what everyone’s opinions are on the postings by a user named MagnumForce over at the MOS boards, but I know Stagestop was fond his postings. Some believe him to be a fraud, others believe he was as he seemed. Regardless, in some of MF’s final posts he mentioned PGF2A and said:
".PGF2, a prostaglandin compound. It produces a local anabolic response."

".PGF2a is an exotic compounds here. The idea is simple: trying to replicate the same stress as vascular occlusion without playing with priapism. The conclusion is contrasted. PGF2a doesn’t replace mechanical stress but seems to have a very pronounced effect on some penile tissues. The administration is quite delicate so I wouldn’t recommending it to anyone."

The part about administration being delicate is probably in reference to using it SubQ, as mentioned in the patent. I haven’t heard anything about using it via IC injection, aside from various speculation on forums.

I’ve still got a lot to look into, as far as these 2 compounds are concerned. A brief browsing of pubmed returns various studies that imply the 2 can sometimes interact with a lot of the other compounds commonly brought up. I’ve linked to some below. I have little official knowledge of this type of academics, so forgive me if they’re off-base or irrelevant.

Some studies:
Topical pgf2a reduces collagen types 1 3 4 in monkey uveoscleral outflow
Topical prostaglandin F2alpha treatment reduces collagen types I, III, and IV in the monkey uveoscleral outflow pathway - PubMed

Pgf2a, cytokines & cyclic mechanical stretch augment mmp-1 secretion from cultured human uterine cervical fibroblast cells.
Prostaglandin F(2alpha), cytokines and cyclic mechanical stretch augment matrix metalloproteinase-1 secretion from cultured human uterine cervical fibroblast cells - PubMed

Vaginal prostaglandin (PGE2 & PGF2a) for induction of labour at term.
Vaginal prostaglandin (PGE2 and PGF2a) for induction of labour at term - PubMed

Prostaglandin E(2) modulation of vascular endothelial growth factor production in murine macrophages.
Prostaglandin E(2) modulation of vascular endothelial growth factor production in murine macrophages - PubMed

Tons of info on PGF2A here:
http://thinkste roids.com/stero … profiles/pgf2a/

And of course, the ChemPE patent:

Just curious if anyone has any thoughts or knowledge on this. I see lots of discussion on PGE1, but never really any of the other prostaglandins, despite them being mentioned in that patent. Would love to hear some opinions. Thanks!

Thanks atmospheric for this valuable contribution!
PGE-2 and especially PGF2a are worth the research and study. Considering research, your second link quoted seems to hit the nail on the head, and I recommend reading the article in full length:
http://molehr.o xfordjournals.o … nt/8/7/681.long

Basic understanding of the snyergies between those prostaglandins: PGE-1, PGE-2 and PGF2a, in combination with insuline-derived growth hormones (such as IGF -1) would be very helpful.

The indications that PGE-2 can induce collagen matrix remodelling are by far stronger than in the case of PGE-1:

Update

The Basics 04: Injections - a means of drug delivery
Is now part of the guide. There is more to follow on the topic of injections with the next basics. So, stay tuned ;)

This is some fantastic news! I found exciting literature, that just hits the nail on the head (lots of nails, actually):

Here are two direct links (no membership required) to studies that deal with

1) Hypertrophy of smooth muscle due to PGF2a
http://yakushi. pharm.or.jp/FUL … 0_2/pdf/211.pdf

2) Interaction of PGE-1, PGE-2 and PGF2a
http://www.ncbi .nlm.nih.gov/pm … s00455-0166.pdf

Did anyone here know that women’s foot are known to get larger, in the sense of that they need larger shoes, after giving birth to babies? Apparently the Relaxin surge can cause ligaments in the foot to elongate, resulting in the feet being splayed out more. That’s from such a short exposure to the stuff. Makes me really wonder what the potential is for also elongating tunica and penis ligs.