Managing Testosterone

I am in my 50s and have had numeorus symptoms that led me to believe I was suffering from low testosterone. I talked to my doctor about it and his response pissed me off. He said, “I can write you a perscription for something. Most guys repsond very well to Viagra.” I knew there and then that I had the wrong doctor. Of all the symptoms I told him about, I never once said anything about sex or erections and he asked me nothing.

Anyway, I decided to take matters into my own hands and I started educating myself. It became obvious that I needed to know what my levels of male hormones and other related levels were. So, I ordered a blood test. It cost me $250. With a comprehensive blood test I now had the information I needed in order to create a plan. I can get into all the details, if you wish, but the highlights were as follows:
- My TOTAL testosterone was high. Actually very high for a male in his 50s.
- My FREE testosterone was low. Not crazy low on its own, but very low when taken as a ratio of free/total.
- My VITAMIN D level was low.
- My FERRITIN level was in the acceptable range.
- My ESTRADIOL level was in the high end of the normal range.
Total testosterone is somewhat meaningless if you don’t know your free testosterone level. What you ultimately want is a healthy free testosterone level. Estradiol is a form of estrogen, commonly referred to as a female hormone (but all men have it and need it).

So, having done some research and reading I formed a phase 1 plan. Increase vitamin D levels and reduce estradiol. Vitamin D is known to help reduce something called sex hormone binding globulin (SHBG) and SHBG binds to testosterone reducing the amount of free testosteone. I had already been taking 2,000 iu of D3 daily in the winter time, so I increased this to 4,000 iu. I have been taking other vitamin/mineral supplements already that compliment vitamin D and help it’s absorbtion, such as magnesium, vitamin K and I consume plenty of calcim, so I didn’t adjust those. Second, I have started consuming much more cruciferous vegetables, like broccoli and cauliflower, and I now drink 8oz of pomegranate juice daily and a daily cup of green tea. This should help reduce estradiol. I’m not very concerned about my estradiol levels, since they are in the normal range and I don’t have any symptoms of a high level, but I wanted to see what would happen if I did lower them.

I mentioned my ferritin level because that may also affect testosterone and feelings of well being. There is emerging research about ferritin levels and that even my normal level could be too high. If phase 1 of my plan produces the results I want, then phase 2 will address ferritin.

I will get my next blood test done 3 months after the previous one and will see what has changed.

The point of this post is I am discovering how important the balance of nutrients and hormones are to our overall health and that without the knowledge of blood work, we are shooting at a target we can’t see. Once I had the blood test results in hand, I could then create a response as opposed to my inept doctor’s response of prescribing a medication I did not need. Since this post is getting long I’ll end here, post more later and respond to questions or comments. I’m really interested in learning more about all this!

Where did you get your vitamin K from? Pharmacy here don’t stock.

I order vitamin K from Amazon.

But can you trust it? I mean if my pharmacy isn’t getting it where is amazon getting it? Has anyone seen vit k in UK pharmacies?

I’ve been on testosterone replacement for several years now, and I’m 45. Your doctor isn’t inept. Truth be told, if you’re going to be doing testosterone replacement, it’s not something that your primary care doc should really be doing unless he’s well versed in it. At most, they’ll prescribe a foam or cream, and personally I’m not overly fond of it. If your total testosterone is high normal, and free testosterone is “low” normal, but normal, testosterone replacement isn’t going to do much for you. Well, it might, but not as much as you might think. I started on it 4 years ago, after getting out of a 20 year marriage and having to go back on the market.. Very scary, and ED reared its ugly face. Testosterone maybe helped some, but it’s main benefit has been to help me gain muscle mass.that’s it. I’m 6’3” and was 161 lbs., and worked out out a fair amount. After being on testosterone, eating a lot more, and working out a little more aggressively, I’m at 195 lbs. Has it helped with mood, sleep, fatigue, etc.? Nah.. I don’t think so. That being said, just taking testosterone alone is a little risky. I take testosterone, HCG (to help me continue to produce my own testosterone and reduce testicular shrinkage), and an estrogen blocker. I have lab work done every 6 months (I did every 3 months when I started), and have to donate blood every 2-3 months. This is something that really has to be done under the guidance of an endocrinologist or specialty clinic. You have to monitor all of you cell counts and keep a close eye on your PSA. If that’s elevated at all, or if you have any sort of prostate enlargement, this will make that a lot worse. And in case you’re wondering, let’s just say that I have a high level degree in the medical field, so I’m pretty knowledgeable about this stuff ;)

Very good thread indeed.

I can’t say I suffer in any area, but of course I watch my PSA and also my Testosterone levels like a hawk when it comes to bi-yearly blood tests.

I did take up Vitamin D a few years back, and it did make a difference, I think. Of course it did coincide with an effort to kick myself into higher gear in general after breaking up with my ex girlfriend. Even though I take a highly ranked multi-vitamin (GNC Mega Men 50 Plus Vitapak Program), I take additional supplements, mainly:

- Alpha Lipoic Acid (it’s a powerful anti-oxidant so good for you)
- Niacin (supposedly helps control cholesterol etc)
- Tribulus and Fenugreek (supposedly help with testosterone levels)
- Vitamin D (I thought it was general well-being but learned more in this thread)
- Lecithin (good for the brain and supposedly cum volume some say)
- Huperzine (brain)
- Choline (brain)

I also eat mostly healthy, fast one day a week, and do intermitent fasting every couple of days or so, depending on weight trends.

ObiWan77 - totally agree the general testosterone stuff does nothing. 3 years ago I asked my doc to prescribe it (they’ll pretty much do anything you them to do :-D) … I forgot the stuff, it was some sort of gel you applied with a platicky cup. It did absolutely zero for me in 6 months.

I’ll admit to using HGH years ago (I did compete in amateur bodybuilding contests but never ever touched steroids), and that stuff seemed potent, or maybe it was because you trained all the harder not wanting to waste a few thou on it. :-) But after I read it may accelerate cancer growth - no thanks. :-/

Excellent topic!

ObiWan - Maybe I wasn’t clear in my original post. I feel my doctor was inept because I didn’t describe any symptoms of ED and his solution was to prescribe an ED med without asking me a single question. I wasn’t looking to jump into testosterone replacement either, I just wanted him to advise me on what I should do. I thought he’d at least order a blood test.

I want to educate myself by doing research and learning from those on this site. Knowledge is power. One thing I’ve learned over the years is that when it comes to health care you have to be your own advocate. You have to carefully select your doctor, you have to ask questions, you have to demand justification for certain actions/test/procedures.prescriptions, etc.

I plan to repeat blood testing every three months initially and if I see improvment and stability then reduce to testing every 6 months.

Swole Straw, I’m not sure about the UK, but here in the US vitamin K is available without a prescription. It is inexpensive and available everywhere, just like all common vitamins.

Damn sucks for me, thanks for the reply

Swole, is there some misunderstanding? I just looked on Amazon UK and vitamin K is widely available.

Haven’t seen them in various pharmacies here, so its alarming for me, iv seen them in other countries pharmacies, so common sense to me at least establishes that over here they know or don’t know something that makes them not stock, hense why I veer away from that particular online purchase.

The reason I was after it was because I had my wisdom teeth extracted and I needed a rapid recovery. But its still good have, my work produces a lot of cuts, sharp metal etc.

I’m not sure how things are in the UK as far as regulating vitamins, but vitamin K is a very common vitamin that is found in many vegetables and eggs, for instance. It is produced commercially by most major vitamin brands and widely sold everywhere. It is not found to be harmful except in the most outrageous doses. Restricting it would be like restricting vitamin C. Very strange to me.

Good thread. I’m big on testosterone because I’m a man that strives to be healthy.

May I ask what some of the “symptoms” that led you to question your test levels were?

I appreciate you doing self studies. Also glad to hear vitamin D being brought up around here. I take 5000iu a day. And during the summer I’ll slow it down to maybe twice a week or so when I’m out getting sun. So many are deficient and have no clue.

How are you zinc and magnesium levels?
How about your sleep cycles? What about stress? How’s your diet? That’s a biggie right there. Do you have a high stressed life, or if so do you have moments where you ground yourself and really give yourself some parasympathetic relief or do you never give yourself a break or time to stabilize. All of this can contribute not only to test levels but also make or break a high quality life.

I could think of much more to ask but in a hurry and figured I’ve asked enough. Again, good topic for us men. Especially with the new younger generations coming into the world full of carcinogens and estrogen loaded everything.

I’m almost 30 and I had a lot of symptoms of low test but the one that got me was not being able to recover after a work out, and it took an abnormal amount of time to heal from a car accident where I had multiple muscle tears still bothering me a year later. I basically has to beg him to refer me to an endocrinologist and my total test was something ridiculous like the 100 and he put me on test E and wouldnt let me take the bottle home.

I went to trade school with someone who happened to go to my gym and offered to help me train. We started talking about gear and when I told him about my trt he got really excited and really took me under his wing. He taught me how to buy test myself and how to pin it. Taught me how to read my results but more importantly introduced me to a local endo who would do the test and interpret the results for me for $25 every 3 months.

I went from like 100 to 750 in 6 months and went from 42%bf to 28% while staying the same weight because I could train my ass off multiple times a week and keep my diet the same and still be in a calorie deficit. When i couldnt afford the gym i went from e3d to bi monthly to monthly to only pinning test if i anticipated having to do a lot of lifting in the next couple days, if i had DOMS for longer than a week, or if i felt the depression coming back. When i was e3d i would cut back if i felt the rage over mundane stuff start kicking in or if my libido was getting out of check.

I’ve been told that testosterone is like the oil in your car. As long as the level is between the lines everything works fine. So low T that is above or on the line does the job just as well and high T that is below or on the line.

When you get higher or lower than the lines is when you have problems.

SB