Starting PE due to concerns that minimal sleep during my teens stunted penis growth

Hi all,

I’d just like to get everyone’s opinions on how logical this seems. So I slept from ages 10-18, and I am only guessing per year, something like 6:45 instead of 9.5 hours like a lot of Australians have gotten in my country (have read this in a study). I know the average for American adolescents is more like from 9 hours at 10 to 7-7.5 hours from ages 13 onward.

If I could go back in time I’d have gone to school a lot closer so I didn’t have to wake up as early. I’m so troubled that sleep has directly resulted in my penis being stunted somewhat.

The below measurements are based on my penis size of 7.9 in. BPEL and 5.5 in MSEG (Please understand I’m totally serious, I know I’m above average, but still can’t help but think I’ve missed some growth)

I have made a spreadsheet calculating all this if anyone would care to see it, but If I say 8.5 hours is the ideal amount of sleep, and anything less will cause stunting, then I’m looking at a loss of 4.44mm in length and 1.55 mm in girth (circumference). Now I’ve assumed 10cm of growth from age 10-18, and if you literally count 9% less sleep multiplied by that 10cm of growth you get 9mm of length missed out, but I’ve chosen to halve that number in order to account for ‘catch up growth (25%) and non-linear growth (25%) that is to say, that after 6 hours of sleep, any more sleep isn’t going to result in as much penile growth or testosterone secretion.

As for girth, I’ve just multiplied the length by 0.5, as girth occurs later in puberty, where I had a more ‘average’ sleep pattern (14-18 on-wards sleeping 6.5 hours, with the average being about 7.25 hours, so minimal losses here)

Ok long story short, never mind my breakdown above, I can describe it in detail with the spreadsheet, but can you guys convince me otherwise, that there is no truth to this? Or your opinions, scientific backing would be great :)

Either way I am on the journey, and I am happy to discuss my PE routine;

IR light warmup;
Left3x30s, Right3x30s, down2x30s, up2x30s stretches under the light;
Warmdown;
Sometimes bathmate (looking to start jelqing instead soon)

I have had OCD about my penis being somewhat stunted for 2 years, I just thought I was overcoming it, but upon seeing the latest Australian sleep report, and realizing how much my peers had slept on average (9.5 hours), plugging those numbers into my spreadsheet I got a scary result of 6.7mm of length lost, and 2.3mm worth of girth (circumference) lost.

Now I know, more likely, if I look at global figures, a baseline of 8.5 hours is more realistic, and my previous figures of 4.4mm length and 1.55mm circumference are more reasonable, yet still conservative enough and erring on the more pessimistic side, I think after 8.5 hours sleep, your penis will probably grow at 10% the rate it would have in the first few hours where growth is full bore.

So, bear in mind, my figures are based on my penis size, and that I have applied a 50% reduction on all the values, so it isn’t ‘tit-for-tat’ where I’m correlating every missed minute of sleep with a linear loss in growth. Do you guys think 50% is accurate, or can I be more generous?

There is ZERO research on this stuff, hence, having gone down this rabbit hole, and being the stubborn OCD ridden man (boy) I am, I’ve tried to break new ground. I’m almost going to buy a couple of lab rats and start experimenting on them!

PS: My spread sheet is attached, it could be a little messy, but it’s all there.

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Well the only solution I can see it to go back in time and tell your past self of your current/future concerns….that should set him strait.

Though I jest, i realize that I do this to myself all the time. Not about penis size but about my weight. I’d go back and tell me that life sucks being fat, do something about it now…tortures me sometimes.

Fuck, know what? If you invent that time machine I’ll go with you.

After reading your entire post, I cannot say that I am persuaded to believe that you would be bigger if you had slept more. Additionally, the amount of calories you burn while being awake versus asleep is an unknown to start with. For you to have slept more perhaps you would have done less during the day or consumed less fuel and if that is the case there is no telling what effect that could have had on your body.

A growth pattern of a human in a natural environment is a perfect storm. You cannot that assume in a vacuum that you can you can pick and choose all factors and then control them. As the unseen factors for your activity level where you lived and what you ate as well as your sleep patterns are all too interwoven to tie your penis growth or the perceived lack thereof to a known lack of sleep.

Your assumption is in fact this proven with the size of your penis now. Has natural penises larger than 8 inches are statistically rarer than quite a bit of any probability set. Meaning even if you slept more it is more likely that you would have found a probability that will have ended with you having a smaller penis than the one you have now.

Aside an aside, serious question. Are you any good at darts?

I would say that your OCD is creating false fears. I spent almost all of my school years staying up from 12 to 3 am then sleeping in on the weekends and my penis was over 8 inches long bone pressed. If what you postulate is true, then I cheated myself out of 9 to 10 inches? Nope. Genetics and health plays a role but I doubt sleep patterns do.

I believe 7.8” BPEL refutes your argument. I have never read and seriously doubt that sleep depravation effects penis growth.

Hey man,

Sounds like OCD to me. You have zero evidence to make your statement, so you also have no reason to have these thoughts. That’s exactly what OCD does. Plus you can’t change the past and you have a really big dick. To put it bluntly… What is this post for? You can either try PE to make your dick bigger if you want a bigger one, or you can become a researcher in “the effect of sleep deprivation during adolescence on the natural growth of the penis; a cohort study”. You’re literally inventing things out of thin air currently.

On a more positive note: you have a huge dick (by most standards) and if you want, you can do PE to make it healthier and bigger. Welcome to TP!

Thanks everyone for the replies, and the buttering up of my ego, I know I am large, but then again most hot women will end up seeing 8 inch BPEL, even though statistically I might be 1 in 20, they may see up to 1 in 5 sexual partners, hung men might have the confidence whether directly or indirectly to get laid more often.

Thanks for the warm welcome to Thunders Place CrusherBrooks, and also thoughtfulgold, I’ve seen your posts and read some of your threads, you’re an inspiration, it’s almost hard to believe after seeing your 9 x 6 photos, what that thing would have looked at at its starting size! Your glans has come a long way too I’d imagine you targeted it specifically or it just came to be as you did your girth work.

Thoughtfulgold, to answer your question, I was a little tubby around age 12, but I started training for wrestling for the next 5 years quite religiously, despite having a shitty sleep schedule, that would’ve made me sleep more efficiently, and at least a boost in hormones. I ate reasonably well, actually quite a bit as I was physically active, but I didn’t want to eat too much as I’d gain weight, and wrestling is competitive enough as it is.

‘How Lack’, thanks again for your input, the spreadsheet is a little big to take a photo of, but feel free to take a look. I feel like I should know intuitively that it makes no difference, but the fact I had it so bad compared to the average sleeper, I can’t shake the thought I may have missed out on some potential growth. I’m closing this case at 5mm of length, and 2.5mm of circumference having been missed, and well, I can gain 10 times that easily in my first year I hope, and I never would have came down the path of PE and done it seriously had it not been for this OCD.

Do you guys think the 50% reduction I did to allow for catch up growth and non-linear loss is reasonable?

Once again I appreciate everything, you guys will see me around a lot here, I’m going to start a progress thread with photos from starting size all the way through, and we’ll see when I can shake this OCD away and realise, I am who I am. I’d say globally I’d be in the lower 15% of sleepers anyway, so I didn’t fare too badly.

Finally thoughfulgold, interesting point, I guess probability would have it that I’d be smaller if I slept more? A crazy thought, as a lack of sleep wouldn’t help growth certainly, but as you said its a perfect storm, maybe it wouldn’t have made a difference at all. As How Lack said, it’s genetics, and luckily I was gifted, and healthy, I think if anything it may have taken me marginally slower to finally reach adult size, but I reached it anyway.

Here is a study about penis length being determined during the MPW while you’re a fetus. It brings me some comfort, as it basically says, any testosterone deficiency during the MPW cannot be repaired later in life, but it implies any deficiency from birth to the end of puberty can be, as there’s a massive window for growth. https://www.mrc .ac.uk/news/bro … al-development/

The basis of everything my theory is based on is, less sleep = less testosterone (for younger guys going through growth, one study showed going from 10 hours to 5 only reduced test by 10-15%!) and also less sleep = less time for cell growth. Now when your penis gets a growth spurt in puberty, it is probably just your body releasing hormones and your dick responding to it, your body isn’t conscious of how long it grows, I’m sure it’s an amazing biological matrix, which is beyond our capability to understand. Insecurity in a relationship led me down this path.

Look at the size of your penis on a normal distribution chart period. Then create a pie chart with that data that accurately has a sliver that accurately represents the size of your penis now and then a microscopic sliver for the size of penis that is larger, still using the objective size distribution data. Then put the chart on a dartboard, step back 20 paces, take three shots of hard liquor, spin around, put on a blindfold then throw one dart.

The odds of your Dart landing on the section of the pie chart that has a penis larger than the size you are as it is now is the same amount of odds that the single factor you wish to change would have in fact done so.

You literally imply that correlation, of your arbitrary choosing, is causation for a perceived deficiency in your size when there’s an unrealistic and incredible surplus. Cherry picking data that loosely follows your hypothesis is incredibly poor research and implementation of the Scientific Method. You break the main rule.

You set out to prove a theory right instead of research a concept objectively on its merits. Selection bias is rife in your chart and assessment as no other sources directly connect penis size development and sleep directly like you have.

You may gather enough “data” to make yourself feel confident you are correct but the method will be convoluted and only have data relevant to you, not everyone else. Look at what you propose and how you propose it and you’ll see it isn’t scientific at all.

Accept your blessings and discard what negativity you were given on your size. This path is much better than searching for fragments to support a theory that you somehow lack something you gave a surplus of.

Be easy on yourself and happy. PE is about getting bigger and happier with yourself.

Women select a partner based on the person, not the penis attached to them. This is not relevant to the question of whether or not your evidence free assumption has any merit.

Increased T and improved your sleep schedule: check. Ate well: check. Exercised: check. Within reasonable sleep schedule: check. So you’re willing to admit that other factors have an influence on your development but you seem hell bent on stating that you would have had a bigger dick if you slept more, DESPITE your single data point suggesting that you have a much larger penis than the probability distribution would suggest. Classic doublethink. “I have a big dick so I have a small dick”

And no, I don’t think your assumption of data manipulation is reasonable until you give any evidence that a correlation exists.

A few points: We do not only grow and regenerate cells during sleep, far from it in fact. You practiced a competitive sports and a combat sports at that, this will have increased T, regeneration, health, sleep efficiency etc. I don’t think you fully appreciate the complexity of the system you’re trying to demand a specific causation from without any evidence. Sorry for being a little harsh but this whole thing has developed into a combination of OCD and the worst type of pseudoscience there is (confirmation bias + emotions).

IT’S ALL IN YOUR HEAD FRIEND. I’m sorry that a previous relationship bruised your ego, but that’s all this is. Denial of facts and the omission of critical thought in favour of emotions won’t often lead to a good place. I advise you to drop the subject altogether and go do something you enjoy. Some bitch was angry at you and said your dick is small, next time laugh at her face and walk away. Seriously, stop tumbling down the rabbit hole.

What is this game called? What do we win? Can I play too? (:

Guys,

I’ve taken everything on board as much as I can. Undoubtedly there’s some cognitive bias in my thoughts, but I don’t want that to disrepute any of my thoughts, call it my ego or whatever, but there’s some raw logic behind this.

All other factors being the same, I am healthy: check, I train: check, I’m not obese: check, having well below average sleep from 10-18, and I have drawn a linear relationship so every hour of lower sleep is correlated with the equivalent loss of growth of the penis. I have then applied a reduction factor of 0.7 to a total of 1cm less length, bringing the total loss to 7mm (This will account for, the loss of growth being non linear, as in growth is much more concentrated in the earlier hours of sleep, and after 6 hours of sleep, any further growth happens at 70% the rate).

I have then applied a factor of 0.5 to this 7mm, which will account for ‘partial catch-up growth’, since catch-up growth would at the worst case, only be 50% of the total lost (I didn’t sleep all that well on the weekends either). Catch-up growth is a real concept, and it implies that growth will take longer, yet some or all of the losses will be recovered.

Lets look at this objectively, you’re sleeping less, which means less GH and Testosterone is released by the body (however minimal) and there is also less time for cell division and growth, so to speak. So undoubtedly in any given night, you’d grow slightly less, although you’d catch that up eventually, to some degree.

I can’t see where the flaw is exactly, yes I’m maybe over assuming the amount that is lost, the initial factor of 0.7 may as-well be 0.3, who is to say, but there is definitely some less growth, maybe I am just entertaining worst case scenarios here. Maybe the catch up factor of 0.5 is too conservative aswell, maybe its more like 0.3 of 7mm..

Can you guys objectively say, that sleeping roughly 2 hours below the recommended sleep time for an adolescent (maybe its more like 1:15 if we include weekend sleep), over the course of 8 years, would cause absolutely no microscopic stunting, not even a couple millimeters?

It’s all over the internet, there are no studies for this stuff, it’s incredibly inhuman to study this, let alone difficult, you’d need twins and you’d need to deprive one of sleep. But, we see time and time again, doctors have even said, that less sleep = less GH and COULD mean that a child/adolescents growth is stunted, and they’re more likely talking about height, but who’s to say it won’t apply to the penis too.

That’s your flaw. You draw a (linear) relationship without a basis to believe there is one outside of conjecture.

Christmas songs make it snow, you know. Really, have you never noticed how it only snows around the time and after Christmas songs have flooded the radio? Also ice cream makes people drown.

Nope, I cannot deny this possibility because there is no evidence for either side of the argument. BUT since you make the claim that growth is stunted, the burden of proof falls on you. You have no evidence so you don’t have a case. Combine that with the fact that you cannot go back in time to tell yourself to sleep more, the anecdotal evidence that you have a big dick ‘so sleep deprivation must have increased your size’ (see how this works? (: ) and you know you’re prone to OCD… Take a step back, evaluate if you are happy with your penis/sexual health. Yes? FANTASTIC. No? You can do PE.
Or become that researcher who gains his PhD in the effects of reduced sleep schedules in adolescent penis development. Those are your options.

You haven’t conducted an experiment. You’ve cherry picked data to support an assumption. This is not science.

1. You picked 2 factors. So far, so good.

2. You have claimed a correlation relationship. No experiment to verify this being more than incidental occurrences was done.

3. You imply this arbitrary correlation = causation. No experiment was done to prove this relationship is real or has an effect on anything to be causation for something.

4. You have zero evidence. No experiment or data exists to draw from to cite, from relevant sources or experiment conducted by yourself.

5. You lack even a hypothesis other than “the amount of sleep I’ve personally had stunted *my* penis growth”. So we are several steps behind even experimentin without a method or even a specific factor to test.

6. Your penis size on every chart known to man that uses data plucked from actual men says your penis is huge!. So discarding data from dozens of proven studies is good science.

7. Lets top it off with most of those studies I mentioned just happening to have adhered to the actual scientific method and conducted respected experiments, peer reviewing and having actual numbers behind all things stated extrapolated from real people for the sole purposes of the experiments in question. Discarding actual science to postulate an opinion is the antithesis of science!

8. You admit cognitive bias, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder and discard every known logical way to gather and disseminate data to pose your assumption to us as fact and ask for our opinion. We need facts to consider, not baseless and admittedly highly slanted opinions!

Do not mistake me. If you want a bigger penis read the material here. This site has it all. I have *written* a ton on the subject *personally* and tried a ridiculous amount of things to enhance my penis and have done so. I have pictures, logs and theories on how to posted up in easy reach in links in my signature.

But do not come here with a hair-brained theory that would need a time-machine to prove in the best case scenario. It makes you sound demented and the rest of us confused when trying to decipher it. It’s just…needless.

The answers you seek do not exist because they cannot . There is no way to collect or verify them. The answers to Penis Enlargement are here. Take advantage of those and the experts who can help.

My best advice.

Thoughtfulgold,

I have used the data from the penile anthropometry study as a basis for the expected growth in puberty.
“J Pediatr (Rio J). 2007 Sep-Oct;83(5):441-6. Epub 2007 Aug 3. Penile anthropometry in Brazilian children and adolescents”

Since my size wasn’t in there distribution, I interpolated. Basically, up till age ten, one’s penis is at the ‘halfway mark’. The other half grows from 10-19 years. In my case, that’s 10cm of length. I had particularly poor sleep from age ten onwards (I had to share a room with an older brother who loved to have his screen glaring at his face till very late at night).

Now, my average from 10-18 is 6:45 minutes of sleep, 8:45 is the ideal (even in American studies, I am in the bottom third of sleepers). That’s two hours less sleep than the minimum recommended, which is actually even below average for Australian students. If I include weekend sleep and holidays, we can assume it’s more like 1:15 less sleep on average per day, for 8 years!

Now, I am hypothesizing here, and I just want the opinions of people who have done PE, the art of growing one’s penis, perhaps you guys can offer your own insight. I am not asking for scientific answers, just tell me your gut feel. If you had slept 1:15 less for 8 years throughout your puberty, would it be more likely you didn’t miss out on any growth, missed out on some, or GAINED growth.

I’d say it’s more likely you missed out on some, indefinite, amount of growth.

I am not going to claim sleep and penis size are DIRECTLY correlated. This is why, I am applying a factor of 0.5 on the gross ‘loss’ (10mm of length), which in hindsight, maybe it could be more like 0.4 [due to training, being healthy (giving me efficient sleep I hope), growth not being directly correlated with sleep/hormones, growth happening during the day, catch-up growth]. We grow in girth too, and there are no charts to show this, but I assume it is of a similar volume as the length increase, so I consider that too.

I know my syntax is not 100%, I’m not presenting things thoroughly, I am not linking the studies which I have read, and let me just say, I’ve read studies which found a negative correlation between sleep and height of children (but that could be due to earlier puberty onset). If I believed there was 100% correlation I wouldn’t apply my reduction factor, but I’m keeping an open mind.

I ask again, one more time, how much would you expect to lose, so if you slept 12% less (12% allows for holiday periods with more sleep too) than the average population, what factor would you apply to get your true losses, if any.

Intuitively, would you think you’d lose some minimal growth, gain some or sleep having absolutely no effect, what’s more likely.

I get it, I have a big penis, but who’s to say it couldn’t have been marginally bigger? My genetics brought me this far, maybe I didn’t optimize my potential though.

Also, my spreadsheet is very messy, It was a lot cleaner initially, I can clean it up and present it again, but I do really want to let this go, but you guys get the jist of it right? I hope I’m not coming off demented or confusing you guys, it’s simple. For every time unit less you sleep than the average, you might lose, in that particular nights growth, half of that time unit (0.5 factor). It cannot be linearly correlated, that would mean kids with insomnia/sleep apnea would grow up with a micropenis. I just want to entertain what that factor should be, that we apply to the linear growth.

Please try and answer some of these questions. I really appreciate your responses thoughtfulgold and crusherbrooks, you guys don’t understand how helpful it is to speak to someone who’ll listen. I don’t want to seem demented, there is some substance to what I am saying, and I say that with no ego.

I started PE because I’ve realised I spent two years, researching this stuff, almost daily, if not, stressing about it. Even big guys have size anxiety, it all started when I saw her flirt with other guys, when she picked up a beetroot at the shops with big eyes and stroked it.

Now I want to do PE, because I would’ve had at least 130% of the size I have now (or 125% of the size I purport I would have been), and would’ve been happier for it, rather than wasting time on OCD.

I wonder, if I can do PE, without becoming more conscious and worried about all this stuff, then it’s the thing to do. Maybe PE isn’t the right path for me in this head-state.

Now please, answer my questions objectively.
Respect.

I was a vegetarian in my preteen years. I suffered from depression. Both of these have massive effects on body chemical balance. As a result, I *suspect* my late puberty which really got in gear at 19 was related. What it did and didn’t do I can’t be sure of. But I can say I felt undergrown. My starting stats were not something to be proud of. I can’t postulate what caused them, though.

I didn’t bother guessing. I had plenty to guess on, if I wanted to though. Everything from my finicky eating habits, calorie intake, staying up nights reading…medication interaction that I likely should have worried about that causes known chemical imbalances in children…but I did not make it my issue then. Doing so now after the fact adds too much extra baggage for not enough benefit and I have enough baggage for a personal tour bus, believe me. I made a big cock for myself instead. It is easier to work on my next move than map my past.

That you want to is up to you. I find it to be a poor practice and once again, your tenuous at best assessment that your huge penis would be more titanic if you had more sleep is…in my objective opinion…horse shit. Period. I have nothing more to add.