Dedicated PE gel

Is anyone here interested in putting our heads together to come up with a purpose designed PE Gel (as opposed to an enlargement gel)?

I’m thinking of something that will combine the benefits of whatever is most peoples favourite lube for jelqing, tweaked to act as a good carrier for some actives (I’m thinking something similar to those stretch-mark creams like Palmers cocoa butter perhaps).

I don’t know if it’s even possible to combine all these things in a single formula and still be able to penetrate deep enough, but I’m surprised nobody has tried to market one (without claiming 2”+ guaranteed etc). I won’t get into detail about it at this point (partly because I don’t know if there’s enough interest or skills, but mostly because I haven’t put the thought into it yet).

What would the wish list look like? The end product could be an open source instruction list descibing how to make the home brew along with various suppliers of the components. Perhaps some enterprising individual could take up the manufacture of it for those that don’t have the time/skill/interest to make their own, with a 50/50 split towards the upkeep of Thunderplace?

Shiver,

The problem with trying to make something like that is the effectiveness of each ingredient in Gel form. Some can’t even be made into a liquid, while effective half life of each ingredient to match supplementing ingredient will take some amazing scientific fomulation.

After reading some of the thread, there seems to be a large amount of mis-information, including info on variety of pro-hormone. Listen up, most pro-hormones are for building muscle, and it is for experience users.

Last time I’d checked, there is no muscle in your penis - other than little bit at the base. Most of these pro-hormones are harmful if not taken carefully and in cycle.

If you want something for erection, I could give you a pointers.

Here’s my short list for PE,

Vitamin supp (if you don’t do bodybuilding where you are burning up lots of vital nutrient, just stick to Centrum type of supp).
Half tab of aspirine - thins your blood, which increase your blood flow.
Any type of anti-inflamatory.

List for mens health,

Tribulus terrestris - must be highest grade
Avena sativa - must be taken with above
L-arginine - take 6-10 mgram broken down to 6-10 serving
or NO2/3/X - take in 2 serving
6OXO - Good for non-aromitization. Must use in cycle of 4-6 weeks on, same amount off.

Stuff not to take unless you are in bodybuilding and know what you are doing,

Anything with ***dior or ***dione (1ad, 4ad, 19 nor-4-androstenediol, 3/5 alpha), DHEA, 1-TEST, Clomit
Most of these ingredient will cause stoppage in your own testosterone production.

Cheers

Shiver have you ever heard of “Superglide” it makes KY Jelly look like sandpaper.

I was thinking more like Verapamil, Vit-E, Zinc, Bromelain. With the possibility of exploring things like phosphoditylcholine, minoxidil, ALT-711, ALCAR etc. Erection enhancers are just gravy that would confuse such a product with the general mass of snake oils out there.

Unless one day someone finds a snake oil that enhances collagen structure and turnover, in which case I envisage something similar to Springfields snake whacking day :D

Shiver.

Off the top of my head, one or two points. I’ll probably think up a few more as time progresses.

Obviously as you say a lube. One that doesn’t lose its lube half way through the session would be good.

I don’t know if a warming ingredient would be possible, but I think would be worthwhile.

One that could help relax ligaments?

Combined with a pumping lubricant with any necessay helpers there,

Whether an ADS lube is possible or desirable I’m not sure. But a lubricant on all day would start to penetrate something, and on the front of one’s pants would not be welcome.

A skin conditioner?

I notice with my penimaster, that I get some soreness on my scrotum as the skin gets stressed under the ‘body’ ring, but there would need to be some sort of pay off between bot lub’ing the head and lubing the balls so it might be better not included.

Probably most of these are obvious anyway, but I’ve included them.

Petit

Other than Sopharma’s own research I havent seen any other studies which show increase in test production due to TT.
Even Sopharma’s study shows that although it increased test by 40% in men with low test levels, it also increased estrogen by 100%.

I think Shiver’s ideas may be more relevant.Im sure Thunder doesn’t what a snake oil on his hands (wait…he doesnt PE anymore so I guess it wouldn’t matter :D ).
This isn’t the “other” site.

If testosterone, DHT etc were beneficial then (personally) I’d just add test or DHT and cut out the efficacy doubts of using other things that purport to get the same result. It’s probably only a cookbook instruction that would be the result anyway, so legal issues wouldn’t be issues at all.

That said, I’ve used both Test and DHT on my unit and didn’t find them to be that effective*. Actually I’ll qualify that a little more. I think they’re critical, but normal levels are more than enough. The issue in my mind is sensitivity to them. Maybe an anti-androgen for a period of weeks/months followed by an androgen would get better results.

*I did see some small temporary and rapid gains but they were unsustainable.

Snake oil eh? Sounds appropriate. Maybe market it under that name, confront naysayers head on, and use the double entendre (sp?).

oh, and wasnt vitamin E good for breaking up collagen or something? I have been semi-superstitiously using vitamin E lotions because of something I read here before, but I cant remember what.

I am in the UK for a while and was in a Boots (like CVS) and noticed KY makes a warming lube now. I did not try it yet but will when my current supply of generic lube runs out. Has anyone tried it?

Pillow

Hmmm! Thanks for info Pillow. I might take a look and see what it’s about. Not keen on Boots though. I’ve had two or three nasty experiences with them - like charging me for a reading lens for my blind eye in a pair of specs.

I’ve tried a couple of lotions from boots (forget the names) that are supposed to be used for aching muscles. I can’t be sure what they did, but subjectively it felt like a chinese burn rather than actual temperature elevation. I didn’t really think much of them though.

I think vit-E may be useful but not groundbreaking. I went into the collagen idea a couple of years back thinking that the idea would be to increase collagen production (more tissue generation=bigger tool?). Once I started reading though I completely turned about face on this. The best information I’ve ever found was in reading about pregnancy and cervical ripening. There is a complex sequence of events approaching full term which involves a combination of some prostaglandins (PGE-1, PGE-2, PGF-2a etc), hyaluronic acid, collagenase, and a whole host of other components that allow primarily Type I and III collagens (CC is mainly Type I & IV), and some smooth muscle to relax, where the collagen thins out and the bundles can unlink and slip allowing dilation.

Some ripening techniques employ a baloon catheter which can stretch the tissues over many hours. In our case that could equate to clamping or extreme pumping. The trouble is, to do this we have to restrict bloodflow. Restricting blood flow causes a rise in TGF-B1 which promotes collagen and stabalises the whole trauma area. To make matters worse it reduces PGE-1 which is beneficial in relaxing collagen and causing the erection. This has a dual effect of causing smooth muscle to waste away while there is a collagen over production which can cause tissue stiffness, or in the extreme even ED.

PGE-2 is another prostaglandin that may be useful (if in the correct tissue types). Relaxin is another (although human relaxin seems ineffective while porcine relaxin seems very effective - don’t know why).

It would seem to me that a multi-staged approach of collagen degradation/turnover, extension, followed by a long period of recovery (deconditioning if you like) would be quite effective. Depending on tissue types, if may have adverse effects on the skin if topical so it could be important to administer differently, or at least avoid stretching the skin. I don’t know if this is chemically or biologically possible, but suspect that anything very effective would also be very prone to disasterous consequences. If we had a mild cream that would lean gently in that direction ( like the original stretch-mark cream proposal) then there may be a solution out there.

It may be as simple as a combination of DSMO with misoprostol (an ulcer drug used off label) along with PGE-1 would do the trick. As much as I consider myself a risk taker in PE, I don’t feel comfortable in trying something like this because of possible irreversible consequences and general lack of knowledge.

Now that I’ve frightened everyone with the risks, and mentioned a little about the areas explored, I hope that it’s clear that I’m not talking about ‘just another lube with some arginine and horny goat weed’, but a genuine targeted (but mild) smart bomb that targets just the appropriate tissues, and the worst case outcome would be a run to the toilet for a flock of seagulls.

I don’t know if this is a bit hardcore for most, or if it’s just a bit hard to fathom. If there’s enough interested then I’m up for researching it, but done alone it could take several lifetimes.

Shiver,

I used to use body lotion/moisturiser for jelking (obviously no therapeutic value like your gel would have - just a lube). Then I read about the dangers of parabens (I think there are various types ethyl, butyl etc.) and have since noticed they seem to be added to most creams, moisturisers, conditioners etc.. There seems to be the most amazing chemical cocktails of ingredients used in cosmetics. I know they test them but I suspect the industry knows that if they do cause problems in the long term it will be very hard for anyone to prove it and in the mean time the big firms still rake in their profits.

I’ve now gone off using anything other a bit of vaseline or olive oil. Am I being unduly paranoid?

What I meant above is that all I wanted was a nice lube without any potentially harmful additives.

If your therapeutic gel worked you would have a world beater. But it sounds a little scary developing it. I don’t understand any of the science behind it but wouldn’t you need the resources of at least a medium sized firm/research lab?

I’ve read that most soaps, shampoos, food containers etc all have less than friendly things in them. I guess it depends what you think will get to you first, all other lifestyle things considered. I was looking the other day at some Johnsons baby shampoo, which because of the name I’d always assumed was a friendly product (nobody hurts babies right?), it is just as bad as almost all of the rest of them.

Personally I’m not looking to bring a product to market, just create an open source ‘cookbook’ ingredients list, written by the many, for the many.

I suspect that a lube and a PE lotion/gel would probably be at cross purposes if combined or used at the same time, but for lube I guess olive oil would be as simple and pure as anything else since it’s biodegradable and a food product.

You guys have not seen the new PE gel? It is a legitimate product from the information I have read recently. On the betterman forums several trustworthy vets on the board have tried it and are experiencing very solid results. It is called Enlargel designed specifically to be used along with PE. It was released in September. They gave the illustration that Penis Enlargement is the car and Enlargel is a supercharger. enlargel.com is the website.