PE and "Permanence"

I haven’t read through the whole thread but here’s an interesting point :

If Hyperplasia (splitting of the cells) is what occurs in the penis, gains are permanent. However, if this is a case of Hypertrophy (enlarging of the cells) gains are definitely not permanent.

Buutttt .. This is how it works for bodybuilders .. I don’t know enough about the physiology of the penis.

This is the most depressing thread I’ve read on here to date. :) Read some wonderful stuff in here over the last 2 weeks since I found the site, but this pulled me back down to earth for a second. Maybe I’m just a pessimist eah?

It’s hard to say that we don’t work out from the penis’s point of view. Even if doing nothing then there will likely be several erections per night when we sleep. Although this may not be intense compared to PE, it could be compared to the difference between a bed ridden person and one who walks about all day but says he doesn’t go to the gym any more - minor activity has a major preservative effect on existing tissues (they justify their existence). Growth is the real investment. Erections cause useful (healthy) chemical changes whos descriptions I’ll save for another thread.

Cell turnover is likely to be slow in the penis compared to the gym guy (muscle is an expensive luxury in metabolic terms). Losses could occur as adaptation in the passive person, but something as simple as a couple of minutes per week may well suffice.

With zero PE I’m sure size would be less than optimal, but speaking as a 5 year part time PE’er, and never having exercised more than about 4-6 weeks continuously with more months off than on (probably 90% off), I can say that I can reach my max length within a week of resuming exercises.

Shiver, how much do you lose if take a significant break? (assuming you ever do). Is the real deal that..if you do lose some gains, you don’t have to work like crazy to get them back, and it’s simply a case of a few light sessions?

I think I’m in the minority here with my beliefs, so it’s worth bearing that in mind before accepting anything said below.

Aside from genuine growth, there seems to be a significant influence from the laxity of the CC. By that I mean that if you imagine a collagen matrix that makes up the tunica, different chemicals/hormones influence how pliable it is. Some allow it to stretch, some make it contract. You may have noticed that after a tough PE session that the stretchiness is reduced(?). These are all short term influences, but it seems to me that the normal cell turnover/remodelling will be based on the average size of this collagen matrix/lattice since the spaces in between are where the fibroblasts are. These are what will brace the structure in response to exercise/damage.

Avoiding PE has benefits and costs. In on sense PE is good because it will cause adaptation in size, but it will also cause the tissues to become stronger and more resilient. Not doing PE will cause a little atrophy but will also allow easier adaptation. It seems to me that growth is the tough part to negotiate, but maintenance is easy.

If I lay off for 6 months or more I might lose 1/16 or even 1/18, but it’s not real losses, as I can easily get it back within about 1 week. I guess it’s like the difference in training between measuring biceps after a regular day or after post workout with intense pump.

So in answer to your question, if the break is not too long then a few light sessions should suffice. Personally I would not want to risk leaving it more than 2-3 months, but I’ve never tried longer. There will of course be exceptions to the rule, and others will have different experiences.

I’ve come to believe that length gains are probably the most permanent - not 100%, but more permanent than girth gains. So, it’s probably best to overshoot your goals (easier said than done, considering how much we have to fight for every 1/4”), therefore when the inevitable receding occurs, you’ll still be around your goal size.

At this stage in my career I’d probably have to agree with that.

It might be something to do with length gains being Ligs and tunica, whereas girth are tunica only.

I didn’t read the entire thread, but I don’t really find it all that depressing. I don’t think 15 minutes of maintenance every other day or so is that big of a deal.

I know its been stated numerous times in this thread, but weightlifting and basically staying healthy require much more time than that.

1.) This is technically still “enlargement,” since you still have a bigger penis than you had before you started PE, and it appears that indeed it has cemented. Even if you do get ‘down’ to say 7.5 in. Erect Length [”EL”], I’m pretty sure that’s still bigger than you had before you started. Same goes for the girth as well.

2.) I don’t see what the big deal is, we all take showers (I would hope!). All we have to do is play with our dicks in the shower for an extra 5-10 minutes once, maybe twice a week… and would the whole “no masturbating rule” still matter? If not, then I think our ‘maintenance session’ would quickly become something we look forward too because it means were going to make our nuts happy :) .

3.) 7.5 in. Erect Length [assuming you actually do happen to lose that much] is obviously more than enough to satisfy a woman. Not to mention the girth you mentioned, I don’t see what you would even be worrying about, you’d still be ahead of the curve, and that’s assuming worse-case-scenario-losses!

Anybody else agree with me? If not, please state your reasons why you believe other wise if you don’t mind so we can all read your reasoning for believing otherwise.

See, I think what you guys had here was just a failure to see what you had/have in front of you. Even if you did go “down” from x-inches to 7.5 inches Erect Length, your still going to be able to more than please a woman. Not to mention like I previously said, especially with the Erect Girth you say to have [the average erect girth is 4.25 inches! How are you complaining?], there is literally no reason to complain, and that’s the truth and everybody know’s it.

Exactly! And that’s even IF it has to be every other day, what if it just has to be once a week, maybe twice a week? What if it doesn’t even have to be 15 minutes, what if it only has to be 5-10 minutes? And like I said above, if the “no masturbation rule” would be rendered pointless (since it’s just maintenance sessions) I think we would all actually be looking forward to our maintenance sessions, whether it’s in the shower or out.

It’s all in your mind :)

God.. This is messed up man.. I’m not doing this the rest of my life >.<

Then you don’t deserve the cock you want, and you won’t ever get it.

The truths hurts don’t it?

I wholeheartedly agree. Everything needs some form of maintenance anyhow. Do you comb your hair, brush your teeth, take a shower, take a dump? Guys, you might as well curse having to eat to stay alive: “God damn it, not another meal for fucks sakes. Why can’t the calories I gain be permanent!”

Exactly. Nothing in this life is forever; everything including ourselves is in a constant state of decay. You have to maintain things if you want to keep them. If you were intelligent but then dor 5 years did nothing more intellectual that watching TV, you would in fact lose some of your sharpness and edge. If you did a degree in French, but go 5 years without speaking or reading a word of french, you would forget almost all of it. Physical qualities in particular are extremely fickle - months even weeks without exercise can have a detrimental effect. I think instead of getting depressed we should instead be thankful that PE is as ‘permanent’ as it is.

Who really expects to reach their goal and then never do PE afterwards? In fact, who expects to be completely satisfied once they reach their goal? It’s unrealistic to expect that after months and years of dedicated PE you will just stop suddenly because your penis hits an arbitrary mark on a ruler. People don’t work like that, it’s the human condition to want more than you have (just look at the people who start at 8”, they still want a longer dick despite already having a size that is the ultimate goal for many).

Ow.

Not to be overly sensitive, but that response seems a bit harsh. And what do you mean ‘truths’? Are there more than one? Which ones are you referring to?

I would say that’s is your prerogative; but remember a lot of what is posted here, pro and con, is speculative, which is worth bearing in mind. What is not speculative is that this stuff does work - in the relative short term, of making you gain size within 6 months to a year. Too many of us here have seen increases (some more significant than others) and know this. The debate has to do with ‘permanence’ - and there are many variables. Types of exercise, discipline and regularity, personal physiology, length of time committed to it, etc. I’m sure diet and overall health have an influence. You get the drift?

Many here seem to feel that gains can be maintained with a minimal routine.

I’m no Mr. Science (more of a Mr. Happy, really), but it seems that there is probably truth on both sides of this discussion. And the meager gains that I have achieved in the fews years of doing very sporadic jelqing I wouldn’t trade for anything. Since 2000 it has been off and on, more off than on and I have had, at best an extra 1” and the heaviest loss has been .25” And I don’t have half the discipline of some here. Granted, that’s my physiology, but my experience is that it works… I came here to see if there could be more efficiency and to get specific ideas of how to improve with regard to my goals, and be more disciplined. I’ve only been here at Thunders since January so it’s too early to tell.

But would I spend a few extra minutes in the shower every morning, to keep things up and running? For me it’d be worth it.

And I can stop anytime I want. Really. NO Really, man. I’m not kidding.

Who am I kidding? I’ll probably stop only when it falls off altogether.