The Penis (smooth) Muscle Theory

Well then we’d need to include rem’s statements that precipitated my original comments…fuck it. Include mine, mine and his, or none.

Whatever.

Fascinating!

Remek,
This is a great find. However, it does get confusing after a while. I’m a smart guy, but economics is more my bag. Between you and Xeno I do get the idea that half the insides of our penis is made from smooth muscle and the other half collagen or some other stuff. Also, that smooth muscle can grow essentially forever (that made my day, being on the thin side) so we must be doing something to halt growth.

The smooth muscle needs stress to force growth, needs rest to promote recovery and also some deconditioning after a while. I understand growth in normal muscles from wasting alot of time on bodybuilding.com, I haven’t seen any thing that tells me how smooth muscles grow. Wikipedia says that smooth muscle is fundamentally different from skeletal muscle and cardiac muscle. So it may grow a little different than skeletal muscles. Xeno your program seems to be based on skeletal muscles.

Sparkyx’s Holy Grail thread basically has guys loaded with ed drugs for a few months and their penises grew. This was extended priaprism, and also clamping theories are starting to turn towards longer term/less pressure or more frequent clamping. In both cases, there are periods of rest daily. But often not whole days off.

Also, what about Pycnogenol, if that study is true why isn’t this all over the ed group boards?

One interesting find about smooth muscles is that when rat intestines (smooth muscle) were exposed to snake venom, they grew significantly. I always thought that guy that posted about wasps stinging his penis for growth had something, I just never had the guts to do it. So why would that happen in smooth muscle, but not skeletal muscle? (or does it, I just don’t know, but I know getting stung in my ass by a nest of hornets once, didn’t make my ass grow).

So thinking outloud and combining these theories, I will take cialis, clamp and pe 2 on 1 off, and take PABA, arginine and pycnogenol.

If anyone had some information on how smooth muscle grows as opposed to skeletal muscle I would be interested. Just my thoughts. Peace.

I have some questions and comments.

In your studies of smooth muscle (which, btw, is very different from skeletal muscle in both form and function) have you seen articles which suggest that smooth muscle tissue is reduced or damaged by priapism - erectile events which I think got all this thinking going in the first place?

Pycnogenol has not been discussed on ED boards, at least to my knowledge. I’d want to see more medical studies of its effects before I considered taking it.

Although I’ve certainly enjoyed the benefits of the various ED drugs for going on a decade, I have a concern about men who do not need them using them often in recreational (let’s include PE here) ways. There has been so far no large and continued study of the long-term effects of chronic supression of the PDE5 enzyme - that’s what Viagra, Levitra, and Cialis do.

Psychological dependence on these drugs is a reality. Do young men with no erectile dysfunction need an ED-med monkey on their backs?

I completely forgot about that wasp stinging thread. It gave me a good laugh way back when I read it. There is quite a few fundamental differences between skeletal and smooth muscle. For one, skeletal muscle is striated (meaning, it is striped), but smooth muscle isn’t (it’s smooth). I still need to do some more reading on the differences between the two, but I know that they both have actin and myosin. Perhaps there is truth behind Protein and gains.

Avocet, I know you run your own ED site, so I am honored to have your opinion here.

First, let me state that in know way am I recommending a correlation between Pycnogenol, L arginine, and gains. I mainly pointed out that abstract for the quote I provided below — to show the relationship between smooth muscle, NO, and erections.

That said, I believe the people that have been studying Pycnogenol are also the same ones selling it. Thus, they could easily skew the results. For example, the study suggests that without Pycnogenol, L-arginine might be useless. This may be true, but the particular study had one fault: The men didn’t have enough L-Arginine to do anything. It is typically recommended to intake at least 6 grams a day, but the study only had the men take 1.7 grams.

However, this doesn’t mean that taking Pycnogenol with L-Arginine won’t work. I’ve read great stories, in fact. Avocet, I don’t know if you have read the book: The Hardness Factor, but I recommend it, for the knowledge, if not for anything else.

The Hardness Factor is a program on “becoming harder.” It involves taking supplements, exercise, proper eating habits, and reducing stress levels. The number one supplement that Dr. Lamm (the author) recommended was a combination of Pycnogenol and L-Arginine. Dr. Lamm also provided “success stories” with this supplement combination. Now how true this is, I’m not sure. Perhaps Dr. Lamm a monetarily interest in Pycnogenol.

Thanks for the comments Avocet. I’m sure that you have more knowledge about ed drugs, but I have read that continued therapy on these drugs for a few months can bring back function in some men so later on they are better without the ed drugs than before. (Maybe I should be asking you if that is true? Is it?) So hopefully they won’t hurt if I cycle them for a few months.

I’m not too concerned about psychological dependence because, well, I’m a horny bastard and won’t wait for a drug just to have sex. But I don’t use porn and during the day it makes it easier to clamp. But I will watch out for that.

I’m not too sure about pycnogenol, but it’s not that expensive and it has a host of other benefits as an antioxidant that have more evidence, and I plan to cycle on it for 3 months and then off it for at least a month. Thanks for the comments.

fig-

My system is based on the results of my experimentation, not on anything else. Muscles smuscles, I really don’t care what my dick is made of, I care about making whatever its made of bigger. Which means I care about two things: its deformational sytematics with respect to stress and time and its adaptive response systematics with respect to stress and time. The training protocol that I recommend was developed iteratively over the course of 4 cycles of training. As I recorded my training and results, I continuously re-designed my training so that the projection of the 3-dimensional work-volume-gains vector onto work-volume (amount of work) 2-dimensional space approximated the (2-D) vector of my maximum rate of gains from all previous training. I also evaluated the velocity (1st derivative) and acceleration (2nd derivative) of my work to arrive at optimal frequency and magnitude of work (some day maybe I’ll write about PE calculus…it’s pure dope, but maybe not, I mean what’s the point, what matters is what it allowed me to determine, and that I’ve already shared). As my training and gains systematics became clearer, it was obvious that an oscillatory system was at work. So I went looking for analogous phenomena in nature that are characterized by the same type oscillatory cyclicity of positive and negative feedback looping systematics that I’d observed in the systematics of my PE training and gains in order to study those systems so that I might gain insight into the systematics of these types of systems. There are all kinds of analogues, volcanic eruptions, earthquakes, landslides, the list goes on and on. They all display cyclicity between processes that serve as positive feedback for the phenomenon in question and negative feedback processes.

But the biological based model of tissue injury and healing, which also is characterized by oscillatory cyclicity just made a lot more sense to use as a model for my data. Although a volcanic eruption mechanics based model for PE gains would work really well too. Had I used that model, I’m sure you’d not have gotten the impression that my system is based on skeletal muscles…or anything biologic for that matter.

I think its great that guys are finding out what dicks are made of, but I’m only interested in so far as I can now call things with more precise names. Woopy do, I was always happy just calling it “tissue”. But, cool, now I can call it smooth muscle. Doesn’t help me grow my dick any. What helps me grow my dick is experimenting with my dick. What I care about is how “it”, whatever “it” is, responds when I apply PE methods to it. Which means I DO science. I’ll let the rest of you read up and research on all matters penile. And I’ll look forward to finding out all the cool names and such that you discover, but IMO, when the rubber hits the road, it don’t mean shit. What does matter is knowing how to do what to your dick to make it grow. Only your dick can teach you that.

For those whose dick tissues’ response systematics are similar to mine, you’ll gain well from the training protocol that I’ve presented. Were I any of you who aren’t gaining well, I’d recommend trying my training protocol. Think of it as the Da Vinci code for your dick :) .

I’ve got to go mow the lawn now, but please do carry on with your chatter you silly monkeys, I find it so amusing.

I think the drugs described in in Spaky’s post more or less provides a long term erection at 100 to 110%. Does it really do anything that clamping does not?

You entertain a few of us too xeno. At times anyway.

Figued that’d get you Thunder.

Well thats just a bonus then, entertainment not being my schtick you know. Knowledge is. What I mostly do is help my fellow monkeys get a little further up the tree of knowledge. Maybe get a bearing on BDI is thats whats wanted.

So you’re welcome. On both accounts :) .

*cough*

1. The Topinama of Brazil

Most likely a made up tribe. Complete absence of any non PE online references.

The Topinama of Brazil (Talalaj & Talalaj, 1994) in the sixteenth century would significantly enlarge their penis by encouraging poisonous snakes to bite their penis. They were in pain for approximately six months but the men felt the pain was worth the sacrifice. At the end of the six months the men had a monstrous sized penis that delighted their women.

* http://www.ejhs … ein/penis20.htm

Perhaps most remarkable of all though, the Topinama of Brazil, who date back to the 16th century, would encourage poisonous snakes to bite them. The pain apparently receded after six months but left the man with a hugely inflated penis that proved popular with the womenfolk.

* http://www.disc overyhealth.co. … y.asp?ID=107583

Tribal PE

Here is the probelm as I see it.

1. The smooth muscle in the penis needs to be exercised and then allowed to repair to grow.
2. The tunica needs to be stressed and stretched to expand.

Are you not trading one for the other?…

If you allow the smooth muscle to recuperate, you also allow the Tunica to recuperate.
If you continually stress the Tunica, you do not allow the smooth muscle to recuperate.

If the Tunica stays strong and some what rigid, can the penis still grow?

I am just throwing out caveats, figaro.

When it’s broke (and one has ED) the ED drugs are very helpful in getting you better off than you were before. They may even help restore penile vascular systems and help nerves regrow after prostate cancer therapies, if used frequently. In these cases, men with an issue might be better off using them chronically, not just taking them when sex might be possible. I am not sure you need to cycle your own (I don’t), or if supressing the PDE5 enzyme repeatedly is a bad thing. I am just wondering.

Guys who have no erectile issues need to pay attention to what using them often may mean in their futures. Will continuous supression at age 28 result in a different enzymatic response at age 38? I haven’t a clue. But if I were younger than I am and didn’t have ED, I’d give myself a heads-up.

Remek’s explanation also explains why some people with screwed up PE workouts still grow. I know many guys that come into the gym and they do the most screwed up workouts. It may not be the best workout, but they do it and it works for them. You see this on these boards all of the time.

People I know ask me how I get in such good shape and I tell them I get in my car and go to the gym. If I can get there 3 days I week I look pretty good. If I get there 5 days a week I look better. I used to go 7 days a week and it was the same as 3 days a week.

This all makes sense, but the Tunica may be the wild limiting factor in this analogy.

PS. The one thing you do not get is the new guy, starts to work out and then 2 weeks later does steroids, grow a bunch and people with twice the knowledge go up and ask him how to work out.