Observations and Questions on Extenders

I use the DIY velcro strap and find it great

http://www.pegy m.com/articles/ … penis-extenders

The pics on making one are at the MoS page but you have to register on the site to see them.

I use it with a small sicicone comfort sleeve with a bit of cloth underneath to stop slipping.

I have also used the vacextender which also works well if you do not overdo it. I used too much tension and got a blister. I now no longer use it because I also pump and am worried the combined use might stress my glans too much and lead to further blisters.

Had another read of this thread.

Rootsnatty wrote

“Using long duration, low load stretching, it is NOT creep that actually causes gains, nor is it true plastic deformation to any great extent. Rather, permanent changes in connective tissue length are caused by fibroblasts actually making more extracellular matrix and proliferating themselves. ” and

“Actually what this is saying is that after 6-8 hours, the OPTIMUM environment is achieved for permanent tissue growth, because at that point strain/displacement will be maximized..”

Now it that is correct and we focus on both LONG Duration and LOW load stretching then would a shorter duration extender routine combined with a longer ADS routine using say golf weights or Xeno’s Cock Coil (CC) work? I can do say 3 hours extending in the morning and then fit the golfweights or CC say for another 8 hours while I do my daily activities then another hour extending and finally an hour dynamic pumping . I suspect the ADS work might be more effective it it is started immediately after am extender session when you are warmed up and already stretched.

I would say that it would be equivalent in effect if the weight of the CC is same as extender tension just from a common sense point of view. But perhaps the engineer here could chime in with more solid mechanics. Or others with more experience overall.

In addition, I had another conversation with the physical therapist yesterday regarding the treatment necessary to regain range of motion. He stated remodeling nd therefore lengthening of ligaments takes place over several weeks during stretching and holding. And doing this three times per day minimum, four days per week. Of course this pertains to post surgical rehab of limbs, elbows, shoulders. Applicable to penis? No direct evidence available. I will say this however. I’ve been doing manual stretches while in the spa at a 103-104 F temp and the member feels even more relaxed, flexible than even when using extender and rice sock heat. So I am going to add in stretches starting 2 days per week working up to 4 while additionally using extender and jelquing. Keep in mind I have only started PE on September 25th. Hope I will have something positive to report in the next three months.

Marinera had suggested an eyeglass neck string instead of the slipping silicone noose for the extender. Thinking along these lines I thought I might try one of the elastic bands I used for skiing that you attach to your sunglasses. It seems the most effective so far. I also use a 1/2” soft foam piece I picked up at a fabric store to go underneath the penis where it rests on the cradle. I uploaded a photo but can’t seem to get the attachment onto this reply here. Maybe a suggestion on that?

Oh, nevermind. There it is, pending approval.

Ectospasm
>I would say that it would be equivalent in effect if the weight of the CC is same as extender tension just from a common sense point of view.

Makes sense. However he real question is what is the minimum weight (or tension for that matter) that must be applied long term for the fibroblasts to grow, assuming Roots theory is correct. Many have found lower tension applied for long periods gets results. I am hoping a normal warm up and extender session followed immediately by a golf weight ADS for a long period might actually work. Gonna give it a go.

Been thinking more about the exchange between Rootsnatty and Marinera,

Marinera is correct to say not all that extend over long periods will grow and also if growth does occur then it will not necessarily fit a linear relationship with time in traction.

On the other hand I am not sure Roots was saying that. He was quoting average results from various studies that suggested on average a linear relationship. There are a lot of other factors at play including tension, warm up and the nature of the various penises which will affect results. In his support there are many here on Thunders and PEGym who say time in traction is the most important thing in getting growth through extending.

This fibroblast theory is certainly worth exploring and if we can get a better handle on it would represent a major breakthrough in PE.

Believe others have had success with that approach. I have never explored it because I find the DIY velcro works great.

Static Stretching Seems to Promote Excellent Growth

This was an earlier approach to stretch relaxation.

If we look at the process of healing and inflammation without regard to the cellular process, all methods of PE somewhat overlap. But some methods may be more efficient of one’s time than others. By this I mean that when we begin exercise of our muscles or stretching of ligaments it is an intermittent process, yet it stimulates changes. Note, I say changes because in the case of muscle we are not increasing the number of muscle cells. The point is there is an initial mediated inflammatory response which touches off the process then, according to genetic programming, cells respond accordingly. This is where what is happening in PE becomes fuzzy because there has not been specific studies done to examine the cellular changes in the connective tissue, corpus s. And c. Etc. Extrapolate all you want from general physiology and other types of tissue, it proves nothing scientifically for that area. The point for me is-

The stretching, warming and manipulation of tissue initiates a process. This process is some order of inflammation. Once set in motion and/or repeated on a regular basis that may be all that is necessary to produce results as we see reported here although to varying degrees. So whether one is hanging, stretching or extending, the important part is the initiation of the process and then repetition. Say for example we want to stretch hamstrings. Not necessary to stretch out for 4 hours. But if we did it 4 times per day for 10 minutes, flexibility would no doubt be noticeably different. I do not poo poo hanging or say it is superior to extending but some thought does lead me to believe that stretching, once conditioned, 3-5 times per day could be effective. Jelquing perhaps can be a supportive process for circulation. One other thing that no evidence directly supports, but I am initiating anyway is transverse frictional massage at the deep dorsal penile-pubic junction. (Google!).

And remember Drs.- First, do no harm!

Actually, according to some recent studies, inflammation is seen only in extreme damage of connective tissue. So there isn’t properly any ‘healing, even after significative injuries’. Add this: cellular proliferation is caused in connective tissue with the smallest amount of elongation; there isn’t really a threshold under which there is no cellular proliferation.

Many disease processes other than acute injury are now looked in part as, so called, “IR”, inflammatory response. And certainly the chronic inflammation of the cardiovascular endothelium that contributes to arteriosclerosis is not extreme damage. But, I understand what you are saying. I was thinking of the possibility that changes in ligaments and dense connective tissue might be induced further by an initial IR from transverse frictional massage.

Ectoplasm, this can enlighten what I am speaking of

Healing?

cellular damage

Good information. Links to the actual literature are very useful.

I think a set-up where, instead if an extender, rather just tied off to a strap below the knee creates the stretch environment where the penis is goins through high and low levels of stretch, but always maintained at a minimum stretch.

Years ago there was considerable discussion about the two similar yet technically quit different set-ups.

I have never used a constant tension extender type set-up, but I did use (and gain ~0.4 inches) the varying tension set-up of tying to the below knee strap.

I have read discussions over the years about the benefits of both philosophies with most typically advocating constant tension, which the good bar extender systems strive to provide.

I don’t know which works better, but I do know the varying tension approach I used worked for me.

Was it mbuc years ago here would worked on a study trying to compare the two approaches?

The difficulty in assessing these different methods is the lack of a controlled study; controlled as in double blind or other statistical metric. Without that it’s pissing in the wind.

In my post earlier, I noted the possible positive advantage from regular stretching routine. Then, reading through threads linking the references above, I saw, Marinera came to the same conclusion in 2008. But extenders apparently do not work on the principle of hanging where there is maximum tension but rather elongation below max but for longer duration. I’m ok with that if it works. But I have yet to see it on myself because I’m just starting.

Ectospasm]
>The difficulty in assessing these different methods is the lack of a controlled study; controlled as in double blind or other statistical metric. Without that it’s pissing in the wind.

Ecto, It would be nice to have proper controlled studies as you suggest but it is unlikely because there is little chance for profit in it. The beauty of fora like Thunders is that we can discover things in a more amateurish way by sharing our experiences as guinea pigs and come up with approaches that work for a lot of us.

>In my post earlier, I noted the possible positive advantage from regular stretching routine. Then, reading through threads linking the references above, I saw, Marinera came to the same conclusion in 2008. But extenders apparently do not work on the principle of hanging where there is maximum tension but rather elongation below max but for longer duration. I’m ok with that if it works.

Yes that seems consistent with a lot of others have found. However there are others that have not had success. What is not clear is whether is due to poor technique or something to do with their penises.

There is also this concept of “less is more” that seems to work for many where lower tension is used in extending.

Laeh’s idea of a below the knee ADS is of interest to me also where in effect it is cyclically stretching as you walk. I find walking with golf weights has a similar effect from the dynamic load. What I am interested in is how low a tension you can use for long periods (say 8 hours at a time) and still see growth. I am hoping if you start with conventionial extending and then swap to an ADS mode without any noticeable break that you will still get this effect. If it works it makes it much easier for most of us to do long periods of PE while we go about other