Gathering Info on how to work up a productive routine for Hard Gainers

There’s a difference between a hardgainer and a total non gainer

It would be interesting to hear from guys who have gained zero for a good length of time including no newbie gains and then somehow managed to start gaining.

Please do not pull this thread it is valid for 90% of people!

I am a sports scientist and I know from my work there is the majority and there is the minority we can not find one methodology for everyone. This is a good discussion biofeedback is key and learning to listen to our body’s signals is important wether that be high EQ or low EQ it is still letting us know where we are at and allowing us to gauge what should come next in the cycle!

Click my signature link ;)

Yeah, this is the culmination of a lot of observation and experimentation. I think for now I would have to rename it, ” Methodology for “less is more” hard gainer guys to Develop a Routine for Girth and Perhaps length”. Hows that for a thread title! LOL.

Anyway, I would say now that this is specifically for using the pump, and for less is more hard gainers. I think its fairly valid for that.

I will go back to the drawing board to see if I can work up a more universal methodology for all hard gainers, but really the biggest take away right now is to realize there are two major catagories, “less is more” and “more is more” and actual there may be a third camp of guys that transition gradually over time from less is more to more is more.

If you plug that concept into your information, it will be of great value in working up a productive routine.

Further an excellent rule of thumb would be that for Girth, Eq is far more important than pure length routines. I would also add that if you are going to push into low EQ during length routines, its probably necessary to use either a stretcher or ADS in between hanging sessions.

Anyway, thats it for now guys!

Dry jelqs r the better ones right? If in the past would there be lubricants for jelqing? I feel the dry is better because your holding the blood in there and really pumping it out, just finished a dry routine with good stretching in the head there.

I do more dry than wet jelqs these days, because I’m lazy! I still think wet jelqs are superior for most guys.

I’m uncut and I think wet jelqs are much better.. But this is not maybe right thread for this discussion.

I noticed that when I just used the ADS device, my EQ went up. Whether I wore it for 2 hours or 6 hours, my EQ seemed stronger than normal.

However, when I added Jelqs, the more I did, the lower my EQ. It’s frustrating when I did a bit too much, and she’s all horney that evening. Yikes!! It’s harder to get up. However, by the next morning, I’m all rested, my EQ’s back, and it’s Hammer Time. HA HA!! Just because my EQ drops hours after, doesn’t necessarily mean that I’ve overtrained, in my mind anyhow. Certainly, like anything, too much of anything can’t be good for you. If I use the analogy of working out, I noticed I get better muscle gains when I get a good, long, exhaustive work out. However, my muscles have already acclimated to my arduous work outs. If not, I would be hurting for days after, and have to take a long rest before working those specific muscles again. So in this case, I’ve overtrained, and believe that it hurt me more than helped. So I agree with many posters that you need to learn your body, how it responds, build up slow & easy to where you get maximum benefits, and then stop for that day. The next day, see how you feel, make any necessary adjustments, and hit it again.

Here’s another interesting thing. According to what I’ve read, the more time you wear your ADS device (hours per day), the quicker the results. However, you need to wear it a minimum of 1,000-1,200 hours to gain 1/2 inch in length. Now what I wonder is whether a person would still gain the 1/2 inch regardless if they took 6 months (worn many more hours per day) or 18 months to reach the 1,000-1,200 hours. Hmmmm.

Charlie,

That’s why I think girth work and length should NOT be done same time. Only LIGHT jelqing if you are doing hanging/ads/extender etc.

About the ADS gain rate, I think there is a minimum hours you MUST do in one day to get the results. I don’t think you will gain that 0.5” if you do like 1 hour every other day even if the total hours would be 1000. I’m not sure if you get what I mean.

Yes mister007, I agree. My goal is a minimum of 4 hours a day. So I’m looking to upwards to 1 - 1.3 years. If I did 8 hours a day, I could half it to 6-8 mo’s which sounds a lot better to me. In fact, maybe I should change my goal to a minimum of 6 hours a day. HAHA

Charlie,

Are you increasing the tension once in a while or do you use same tension all the time? I think I saw some extender study on google and they talked something about increasing the stretching force from under 1 pounds to something close to 3 pounds in 6 months.

Well, I just googled the study. I don’t know if this is real or not: Penile Extenders Actually Might Work, Doctors Say | Live Science

Looks like a legit article, but no link to the study…too bad. I think the conclusions are reasonable, although most guys here who use extenders also report some girth gains.

I think the important take away from that article is the force range of 1.3 pounds to 2.6 pounds. I think most of the failure with extenders occurs when going above those ranges.

I think the two most important perimeters for extenders is enough time, and not too much force. Probably more time (min 6-8 hrs a day) within that force range, but I am just guessing.

Mister007 — I started out at around 1 to 1.5 lbs, and continued that for a month or so. Now I’m up to 3 lbs. Some devices such as the X4 Extender shows it in grams. If 2 lines on my extension rod are showing, that’s about 1400g which converts to 3 lbs. Any more that that, I have real problems with slippage. In fact, I have problems with slippage at 1400g, but to combat that, I force blood into the glans so that I get “Head Swell.” Head swell will significantly help keep the upper strap from slipping over the head, but the side effect is that it may actually help increase the size of the glans. I read a commentary on that but can’t for the life remember where I found it. Also, regarding slippage, I’ve heard some guys are poking holes in the comfort straps and placing a nail through it. I’m scared to do that because I fear I’ll rip the strap & replacement costs are OUT OF THIS WORLD. I bought 4 cheap cylindrical pieces of foam that go over the penis, and reside between the penis & comfort strap, and they charged me like $20-30 (shipping alone was about $8). It’s a real racket, but guess I can’t blame them.

I’ve read articles that suggest you may be able to get results at lower tension settings (like 800g or 1 lb), but honestly, although I felt it was stretching the penis to some degree but not putting enough force to cause the cells to modify by splitting & multiplying. Just my thought. And then there’s too much tension. You never want to feel pain. If so, reduce tension IMMEDIATELY. I’ve never felt pain even at 3 lbs, and believe I could go higher if I could prevent the slippage. If you’re like me, you’ll probably get irritation of the skin, and I find that kind of pain normal because it quickly goes away and the skin returns back to normal. X4 Labs suggests (I have the link) that you wear it 2 hours, take a rest, jelq for maybe 20 minutes, and then put the extender back on for another 2 hour session. They suggest starting with 2-4 hours, and then gradually work to 6 hours total. I don’t remember reading anywhere that suggests more than 6 hours, but I’ve read studies that had their participants wear them upwards to 8-12 hours. So who knows. I’ve also read that the degree of gain is 1:1 relationship to the time worn. So 8 hours a day will get you results twice as fast as 4 hours per day.

This is IMPORTANT: When wearing the extender, you MUST keep an eye on it every 15 minutes because you will notice the tension decrease, and you will have to adjust it back to your target tension (in my case 1400g or 3 lbs). Also, some advertisers say you can wear it under your clothes. HAHAHA!! FORGET IT!! It looks like I have a baseball bat with nail driven into it under my pants. It’s ridiculously obvious. The only way I could hide it was to put my head up against my belly button, cinch in in place with my belt, & wear a BIG ASS COAT. And I only would do that when I walk out to my mailbox and back. :) Plus, even if you could hide it, your movements can cause the extender to slip, or pinch or catch a pube (OUCH that hurts like a mother - I suggest trimming the area!) So if you think you’re going to wear it to work, forget it. Sorry to disappoint some of you.

I don’t think there are any studies that compare usage by tension settings, and the subsequent results. I think that there is just too many theories, and we’re the ginnie pigs. It’s up to us to share our results with each other. If someone is getting nice results with low tension, share it. If a person is getting no results with low tension, but started getting results with higher tension, share it. It’ll be some time 6 -12 mo’s (I’m 2 mo’s in) before I expect any real results, and I will let you guys know. I got the Extender last Summer, used it 2-3 mo’s low tension (maybe 1 lb or 800g), and didn’t know what the heck I was doing. HA HA!! I had a general idea of my measurements, but wasn’t scientific about it. I do feel that I’ve grown my flaccid length (which is not my goal) and a little erect length (guessing 1/8 - 1/4 inch max) after about 3-4 mo’s, but have no before & after measurements. Well, I take that back. I did have a measurement (can’t remember if it was BPEL) from way back when I was curious about my length, and my BPEL now. If I did a BPEL measurement last year, then I’ve gained 1/4 inch. Again, not confirmed. Unfortunately, I also can’t say this gain was all to do with the extender because I was also doing some jelqing, and still am.

I’ve been keeping track for a month now, and that’s my new starting point. I’ve decided that I needed to keep measurements, track them, and also have a method that shows based on my goals, how much gain I should expect to see. I’m also adding my time jelqing into the equation. I started tracking 1/17/2012. Since then I have 83 hours with the extender, and about 22 hours jelqing. Based on 105 hours of these combined exercises, I’m estimating I’m about 10% the way to 1/2 inch gain in length. Dude, that is slow. HA HA!! YUP! That’s why I believe it requires patience, dedication and trust in the process. Many advertisers are promoting ridiculous results (like 1-3 inches in 6 mo’s - B.S.), and anyone expecting those types of results will be seriously disappointed. I personally believe that 1/2 inch gain would be great, and if I was the lucky person to get even more, I’d be shocked & excited.

Right. What you want to do with these devices is holding your penis at a given length for a total number of hours, so overtime it slowly grows to stay at that length with little or no force. If you are pushing with singificatively more force than it is required to hold your penis at that length, your are just strengthening your penis IMO.

Marinera - I have a different theory. My theory is that there has to be sufficient force to cause the cells in the penis to expand/enlarge and/or split/multiply. I believe the penis is being forced to adapt to the tension that’s being placed on it in search of equilibrium. The body has an amazing way of adapting to it’s environment. Once equilibrium is met, the penis has no further reason to grow any more. So, by keeping the tension up, challenging the penis each & every day, it will eventually succumb, and grow to the stretch point (by growing to equalize the pressure being placed of it), thus gaining length. Without this challenge, I don’t see why the penis would make any adaptations because the forces are only keeping it stretched within tolerable limits of existing equilibrium, or gains will be minimal at best. Again, this is only my theory and what I’ve gleaned through my readings. I’m by no means an expert in cell structure and physiology.

Does anyone have any thoughts, research, studies, or physiological truths that they would like to share that would support any of our theories?