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Dang somebody else who knows how it feels, except in my case I’ve gained neither girth nor lengthwise in the 8 months I’ve been at it, but on top of that, I actually found jelqing when I was 15 and 3 years later I can comfortably say I know the jelq very well…
As a result I’m essentially seeing no results on an advanced routine.
Start: (Dec 07) 6.5 NBPEL / 5.2 EG
Goal: 8.0 NBPEL / 6.0 EG
Current 7"NBPEL / 5.5 EG
4thewind,
I think you’ve given manual exercises a valiant effort, but you know what they say about trying the same thing repeatedly without results (it’s the textbook definition of “the crazies”). I’m not trying to call you insane; What I am suggesting is: is that you change it up, and if you are dedicated enough maybe take some added risk.
I’m in the same boat as you on girth measurements 4.5 which is on the shallow end of average, and I do not think many people who frequent this forum give the deviation between a 4.5 and a 5 any thought when it comes to growth factors and physiological preconditions that effect a routines success. I myself have tried a dedicated 3 - 4 month manual routine with no noticeable results. Unfortunately it seems to be the case that men with thin penises ( and I define that as any man under 5” base girth) have a much greater challenge at achieving girth gains simply because our bodies and tendons/ ligs in particular are not designed to sustain that much tissue; Also thin PE beginner would have to achieve an amazing 50% volume increase all in girth from say about 10 cubic inches (based on 4.5g X 61/4”L) to increase their girth to the “big-average” realm of 5.4” (about the size of a cardboard spool for TP). That’s WITHOUT any length. Whereas a man with a 5.0 girth and similar length only has to increase his volume by 20% to achieve the same goal. This means that you are at the very least going to have to grow 2.5 times more than Mr. 5 incher.
I think you also have to start looking at and learning about your physiology, metabolism, hell even family history. Is you muscle mass very tight and sinewy, but small in size? Do you eat alot and not put on weight (could be high metabolism or malabsorbtion of nutrients or both)? Is your full erection very rigid or does it give a little under your grip? What angle is your LOT? Etc.Etc..
The ease with which your entire body is affected by conditioning (diet/ execrise/ or conversely overeating and sedentary) very likely correlates with the way stresses will
Affect your genitals. Many people tend to take an approach to PE which does not recognise that your penis is a part of the rest of your body and has the same genetic predispositions and unique response to stress. We suppose that the same method which added two inches L and an inch of G to the guy that was a 7 ” X 5.5” to begin with and also happens to be a large bodybuilder who was star QB in high school and has a 1200 Testosterone count should work for us..
Possible? Yes. Maybe even likely. But if it doesn’t work after 6 to 9 months of dedication and tweaks here and there. It ain’t happenin’. And I don’t want to try and create a schism, when support and coaching is concerned, between the people who started big and got bigger or those who have stirsticks for dicks like me and haven’t gained a hair. I do, however, think unsuccessful PEers need to stop beating themselves up when the vets and easy gainers insist that they are performing the fundamental exercises incorrectly because they worked for them. There are only so many combinations of incorrectly manipulating and warming your wang to exhaust before doing them right (part of the beauty of the workouts is their simplicity and the fact that you can DL video of them clearly being done).
As for solutions to your (our) problem. I think you should start exploring combinations of more intense methods. Get a bib hanger going, or fiddle with similar warehouse materials until you come up with a harness that’s is comfortable (AND SAFE! No noose.). I’ve dabbled in hanging; Got up to twelve pounds for 10 min increments. Got lazy with it after bout 3 weeks (obviously not enough), but did notice a soreness deep in the penis similar to DOMS that felt on the right track somehow. Anyhow I never got that feeling from manual work no matter how hard soft of long I stretched. The trick with hanging is to find the position where there is an equallibrium of pull on the skin around the base ligs and pressure on the glans (with less pressure on the glans and none if possible though I have not figured that part out). There will be intense and sometimes painful sensation (especially when the skin is taught). You can alleviate tension by repositioning while seated and edging or bending of the lowerback while standing. You have gone too far or have wrapped incorrectly when you feel pinching at the glans, sudden sharp pain, or the glans is deep purple (red purple OK the blue tones or pale yellow with numbness denotes a lack of oxygen to tissues and or capillaries are bursting. Always make it extremely easy to release tension. I didn’t even mess around unclasping the caribeaner. I fastened a leash to the weight and immediately tugged up at the first sign of odd feeling; then unhooked.
I’m a pretty regular clamper. But have not gone to intense and have not seen permanent gains. I will say that while clamped the engorged feeling is great and once flaccid it is much larger for a long duration. At the next erection, however, no gains.. So far. Maybe you do have to go at it until there is discoloration; Haven’t worked up the nerve yet. I still think it is a key exercise in girth gains, but there is could be a connection with initial base girth and how much it will benefit. I am 4.5”g at the base when skin is stretched back and slightly thicker at top (with a mighty 5.5” rim on my glans; very top heavy). Many people report great base gains with hanging and conversely clampers report girth throughout the shaft. Maybe by combining the two you can get a better swelling effect in the shaft from clamping on the added base girth.
After a hanging / clamp routine (and yes lets not forget at least 5 -10 mins warm wrap + manual stretching warm up (which I know to be vital but often forget) If you do not see any gains from that alone you may try an ADS post workout (home made of course. Do not waste money buying one. I’ve done it twice and it isn’t necessary). Use a small dowel style wrap (that applies very little pressure to the -SIDES- NOT dorsal/ ventral of the shaft near the glans.. Basically replicate the hanging apparatus but instead use an ELASTIC length of string and tie the other end loosely below one knee.. Rig the string so it has a clamping adjuster for tightening (like the draw string off a hoody sweater). The tension should be so light that you could potentially sleep in it without noticing. A cold glans is okay. A numb one is not. The theory behind wearing this device post work out (and it is a sound theory) is so the elastic collagen fibers repair in a desirable way. Pretend you are lame enough to play the accordion and one day your dog gets one end of it and you play tugowar.. Parts of the accordion tear open but it doesn’t break in two. If you used glue to repair it would you compress it all the way and start pouring glue all over OR would you stretch it out and glue? You’d stretch it out so it doesn’t get stuck shut.. Penis.. Same thing. Collagen latices fill in gaps in the super structure of the ligs and tendons like spider webbing. Over time the process repeats, elasticity potential decreases, while load bearing and mass increases. It isn’t theory. Thats why Schwartzenager spent 2 hours swimming and doing ballet for every hour he spent pumping. He new to stretch gently.
Other angles to incorporate: Why just warm up at the beginning of the workout? Get an in-fared light (heat lamp) and position it in front of your goods while your hanging / clamping or hell sleeping if you can figure it out. Just don’t let the fireman recover your charred body in the middle of some PE ritual. “I.. I think it’s an ADS device sir.” “A what?”.. “Never mind sir.” Different types of light stimulate the natural world on a cellular level in amazing ways and I don’t doubt it has positive affects on the inflammation process in humans.
Consider supplements: Creatine, L Argine, NO2, Glutamine, Saw Palmeto, Multivitamin, Collagen or some combo of. NO PE PILLS NOT EVEN TO SUPPLEMENT> SCAM SCAM SCAM!
What else?. Safely but strategically maintain a muscle confusion style regiment. Vary your routine as soon as you hit a plateau. Not working. Give it two to Three months and move on. When hanging spend some time lowering the weight before increasing. Gently stretch and bend while clamping.
I guess the summary is: make it a hobby don’t lose sight of the goal but don’t focus on it. Take the journey.
Well that was probably the most advice from someone with no gains but it helps keep me motivated to get all my unused knowledge out. It isn’t the end of your PE journey when Manual doesn’t work. Many vets preach and swear by them, but there are those who can never and will never gain from them even if the have a personal trainer helping them with reps (ewww). Don’t throw them out completely, but don’t rely on them.
-Stirstick
And I’m spent.
4thewind,I think you’ve given manual exercises a valiant effort, but you know what they say about trying the same thing repeatedly without results (it’s the textbook definition of “the crazies”). I’m not trying to call you insane; What I am suggesting is: is that you change it up, and if you are dedicated enough maybe take some added risk.
I’m in the same boat as you on girth measurements 4.5 which is on the shallow end of average, and I do not think many people who frequent this forum give the deviation between a 4.5 and a 5 any thought when it comes to growth factors and physiological preconditions that effect a routines success. I myself have tried a dedicated 3 - 4 month manual routine with no noticeable results. Unfortunately it seems to be the case that men with thin penises ( and I define that as any man under 5” base girth) have a much greater challenge at achieving girth gains simply because our bodies and tendons/ ligs in particular are not designed to sustain that much tissue; Also thin PE beginner would have to achieve an amazing 50% volume increase all in girth from say about 10 cubic inches (based on 4.5g X 61/4”L) to increase their girth to the “big-average” realm of 5.4” (about the size of a cardboard spool for TP). That’s WITHOUT any length. Whereas a man with a 5.0 girth and similar length only has to increase his volume by 20% to achieve the same goal. This means that you are at the very least going to have to grow 2.5 times more than Mr. 5 incher.
I think you also have to start looking at and learning about your physiology, metabolism, hell even family history. Is you muscle mass very tight and sinewy, but small in size? Do you eat alot and not put on weight (could be high metabolism or malabsorbtion of nutrients or both)? Is your full erection very rigid or does it give a little under your grip? What angle is your LOT? Etc.Etc..
The ease with which your entire body is affected by conditioning (diet/ execrise/ or conversely overeating and sedentary) very likely correlates with the way stresses will
Affect your genitals. Many people tend to take an approach to PE which does not recognise that your penis is a part of the rest of your body and has the same genetic predispositions and unique response to stress. We suppose that the same method which added two inches L and an inch of G to the guy that was a 7 ” X 5.5” to begin with and also happens to be a large bodybuilder who was star QB in high school and has a 1200 Testosterone count should work for us..Possible? Yes. Maybe even likely. But if it doesn’t work after 6 to 9 months of dedication and tweaks here and there. It ain’t happenin’. And I don’t want to try and create a schism, when support and coaching is concerned, between the people who started big and got bigger or those who have stirsticks for dicks like me and haven’t gained a hair. I do, however, think unsuccessful PEers need to stop beating themselves up when the vets and easy gainers insist that they are performing the fundamental exercises incorrectly because they worked for them. There are only so many combinations of incorrectly manipulating and warming your wang to exhaust before doing them right (part of the beauty of the workouts is their simplicity and the fact that you can DL video of them clearly being done).
As for solutions to your (our) problem. I think you should start exploring combinations of more intense methods. Get a bib hanger going, or fiddle with similar warehouse materials until you come up with a harness that’s is comfortable (AND SAFE! No noose.). I’ve dabbled in hanging; Got up to twelve pounds for 10 min increments. Got lazy with it after bout 3 weeks (obviously not enough), but did notice a soreness deep in the penis similar to DOMS that felt on the right track somehow. Anyhow I never got that feeling from manual work no matter how hard soft of long I stretched. The trick with hanging is to find the position where there is an equallibrium of pull on the skin around the base ligs and pressure on the glans (with less pressure on the glans and none if possible though I have not figured that part out). There will be intense and sometimes painful sensation (especially when the skin is taught). You can alleviate tension by repositioning while seated and edging or bending of the lowerback while standing. You have gone too far or have wrapped incorrectly when you feel pinching at the glans, sudden sharp pain, or the glans is deep purple (red purple OK the blue tones or pale yellow with numbness denotes a lack of oxygen to tissues and or capillaries are bursting. Always make it extremely easy to release tension. I didn’t even mess around unclasping the caribeaner. I fastened a leash to the weight and immediately tugged up at the first sign of odd feeling; then unhooked.
I’m a pretty regular clamper. But have not gone to intense and have not seen permanent gains. I will say that while clamped the engorged feeling is great and once flaccid it is much larger for a long duration. At the next erection, however, no gains.. So far. Maybe you do have to go at it until there is discoloration; Haven’t worked up the nerve yet. I still think it is a key exercise in girth gains, but there is could be a connection with initial base girth and how much it will benefit. I am 4.5”g at the base when skin is stretched back and slightly thicker at top (with a mighty 5.5” rim on my glans; very top heavy). Many people report great base gains with hanging and conversely clampers report girth throughout the shaft. Maybe by combining the two you can get a better swelling effect in the shaft from clamping on the added base girth.
After a hanging / clamp routine (and yes lets not forget at least 5 -10 mins warm wrap + manual stretching warm up (which I know to be vital but often forget) If you do not see any gains from that alone you may try an ADS post workout (home made of course. Do not waste money buying one. I’ve done it twice and it isn’t necessary). Use a small dowel style wrap (that applies very little pressure to the -SIDES- NOT dorsal/ ventral of the shaft near the glans.. Basically replicate the hanging apparatus but instead use an ELASTIC length of string and tie the other end loosely below one knee.. Rig the string so it has a clamping adjuster for tightening (like the draw string off a hoody sweater). The tension should be so light that you could potentially sleep in it without noticing. A cold glans is okay. A numb one is not. The theory behind wearing this device post work out (and it is a sound theory) is so the elastic collagen fibers repair in a desirable way. Pretend you are lame enough to play the accordion and one day your dog gets one end of it and you play tugowar.. Parts of the accordion tear open but it doesn’t break in two. If you used glue to repair it would you compress it all the way and start pouring glue all over OR would you stretch it out and glue? You’d stretch it out so it doesn’t get stuck shut.. Penis.. Same thing. Collagen latices fill in gaps in the super structure of the ligs and tendons like spider webbing. Over time the process repeats, elasticity potential decreases, while load bearing and mass increases. It isn’t theory. Thats why Schwartzenager spent 2 hours swimming and doing ballet for every hour he spent pumping. He new to stretch gently.
Other angles to incorporate: Why just warm up at the beginning of the workout? Get an in-fared light (heat lamp) and position it in front of your goods while your hanging / clamping or hell sleeping if you can figure it out. Just don’t let the fireman recover your charred body in the middle of some PE ritual. “I.. I think it’s an ADS device sir.” “A what?”.. “Never mind sir.” Different types of light stimulate the natural world on a cellular level in amazing ways and I don’t doubt it has positive affects on the inflammation process in humans.
Consider supplements: Creatine, L Argine, NO2, Glutamine, Saw Palmeto, Multivitamin, Collagen or some combo of. NO PE PILLS NOT EVEN TO SUPPLEMENT> SCAM SCAM SCAM!
What else?. Safely but strategically maintain a muscle confusion style regiment. Vary your routine as soon as you hit a plateau. Not working. Give it two to Three months and move on. When hanging spend some time lowering the weight before increasing. Gently stretch and bend while clamping.
I guess the summary is: make it a hobby don’t lose sight of the goal but don’t focus on it. Take the journey.
Well that was probably the most advice from someone with no gains but it helps keep me motivated to get all my unused knowledge out. It isn’t the end of your PE journey when Manual doesn’t work. Many vets preach and swear by them, but there are those who can never and will never gain from them even if the have a personal trainer helping them with reps (ewww). Don’t throw them out completely, but don’t rely on them.
-Stirstick
And I’m spent.
This. Very well said.
Wow… thanks for the comments dude! Very insightful. I probably should have mentioned that in all this time I actually did switch up my routine several times, and actually only for the past month or two I have focused exclusively on girth. I really am considering clamping, but the only thing holding me back is that I read that it may mean the end of future length gains, and I haven’t quite hit my length goal (although I am very content with my 7 BPEL— started out with 5.75, but I want to get to about 7.5).
I guess in general you could say I’m on the skinny side, but I am fairly in shape. I can definitely eat a lot of crap and not gain weight although I may see acne if its greasy. However, when I work out at the gym it seems like I see responses fairly quickly. Perhaps you are right in finding something that will be a complete switch from what I have been doing to keep my dick guessing, so maybe it’s about time I put that ADS together and finish these length gains, then think about clamping later.
It’s just that above all, I want a good LOOKING dick, and admittedly some of the goals people have on this forum would just look absolutely ridiculous on my body… I don’t think the smallest part of my wrist has as much girth as some of these goals! Anyway, the point was that a 7.5x4.5 just looks funny. My 7x4.5 already looks like a stick, even though the base is about 5.1 and head is somewhere in between (I never figured out how people measure head girth since mine has a sort of diagonal shape to it).
I will give this another couple of weeks and at least up the number of jelqs to a reasonable amount before dismissing their effectiveness. Right now I am doing 225 per session (various types of jelqs) and I should at least get up to 300 or 400 before changing it up, right?
If you want girth jelq 3 times a day 10 to 15 minutes a session. It keeps you plump and growing all day long.
In search of a perfect body, penis, and girl.
The search NO longer continues. :)
Just wanted to give an update. So far I have seen zero results, except my flaccid has gotten smaller the past two weeks. I am doing a 1 day 2 off schedule but I generally do not have a good feeling about this. I am not getting morning wood, erections are harder to get, I have been measuring EG after every workout and noticed that I haven’t gained any expansion right after (I did that to see if I was expanding, not cause I’m obsessed). Every time I have gained in the past my dick at least felt good. I think it’s about time to abandon this, finish my length goals with an ADS and then clamp like crazy!
The way I look at a 1 on 2 off schedule is this: in order to need 2 days for recovery, you should be doing a pretty damn intense routine and should undoubtedly see measurable differences afterwards.
In search of a perfect body, penis, and girl.
The search NO longer continues. :)
Just wanted to give an update. So far I have seen zero results, except my flaccid has gotten smaller the past two weeks. I am doing a 1 day 2 off schedule but I generally do not have a good feeling about this. I am not getting morning wood, erections are harder to get, I have been measuring EG after every workout and noticed that I haven’t gained any expansion right after (I did that to see if I was expanding, not cause I’m obsessed). Every time I have gained in the past my dick at least felt good. I think it’s about time to abandon this, finish my length goals with an ADS and then clamp like crazy!
Shrunken flaccid and bad EQ sounds like you’re overtrained to me. Never forget the PI’s
except my flaccid has gotten smaller the past two weeks <SNIP> I am not getting morning wood, erections are harder to get
Whatever you are doing, you are way overtraining. You need to take 2 - 3 weeks completely off until your penis recovers. If you have not read these articles before take a look:
Start: BPEL 6.5" BaseEG 5.0" MidEG 4.5" | Now: BPEL 7.0" BaseEG 5.75+" -- MidEG 5.0"
Penis Size - A realistic view | Young Guys - SiZE ANXIETY is DUMB |
Is Starting out Lesser Better? | Physiologic Indicators (PIs) to help growth! | Linear Newbie Routine | Sta-kool's Re-tool/Revival mid 2017: Libido, cock, physique | Sta-kool's Icicle Diary Vol. 5
I understand sta-kool, which I why I brought it up in the first place. I just think it’s funny that I actually REDUCED my routine’s intensity and this happened. Before I have tried Uli’s, Horse440s, O-bends, etc. with only one day rest without any noticeable problems. Maybe the culprit is the jelq squeezes I am doing, or maybe just my shitty health habits lately. What’s wrong with just switching to a length focused routine? My current routine barely even contains stretching, so I can switch it up while my penis recovers from the girth exercises right?
Spaghetti I hear what you are saying but if my dick doesn’t feel good after two days rest I don’t think it would be better if I reduced it to one day…
Reread Sparkyx’s “Warning” article. If you are not getting morning wood or having trouble getting erections, you need to stop all PE for a couple weeks or so until you recover. If not you are not letting it recover.
What is the hurry? Are you planning to get rid of your dick in a couple of months and need to make it bigger by the end of this week for one last fling?
I didn’t think so. Hopefully you plan to keep your dick around for a while.
Time off is not going to kill you. Time off is going to revive your dick.
Just my humble opinion, but I am not the only one to have it.
Start: BPEL 6.5" BaseEG 5.0" MidEG 4.5" | Now: BPEL 7.0" BaseEG 5.75+" -- MidEG 5.0"
Penis Size - A realistic view | Young Guys - SiZE ANXIETY is DUMB |
Is Starting out Lesser Better? | Physiologic Indicators (PIs) to help growth! | Linear Newbie Routine | Sta-kool's Re-tool/Revival mid 2017: Libido, cock, physique | Sta-kool's Icicle Diary Vol. 5
Sorry, I should have made myself more clear… I’ve been at this routine for nearly the past month but the erection problems only really happened in the last day or two. The flaccid length doesn’t concern me as much since that seems to fluctuate for me all the time anyways. For the most part my dick hasn’t felt good on this routine but not bad either… just the same mediocrity that comes with being stuck in any plateau. So that’s why it didn’t make sense to me to decon for a few weeks at the first sign of a weak erection, but considering that there are zero positive PI’s and a few minor negative PI’s I just thought I could switch it up. Sorry for the confusion, but if you read this and still think I ought to decon then let me know.
This is not “decon” we are talking here, this is rest and recovery.
Take 2 or 3 days off and see what happens. If your penis says it wants more time (no night wood, etc) give it more time. My number one rule for PE is listen to your body. Your body is trying to tell you something.
Start: BPEL 6.5" BaseEG 5.0" MidEG 4.5" | Now: BPEL 7.0" BaseEG 5.75+" -- MidEG 5.0"
Penis Size - A realistic view | Young Guys - SiZE ANXIETY is DUMB |
Is Starting out Lesser Better? | Physiologic Indicators (PIs) to help growth! | Linear Newbie Routine | Sta-kool's Re-tool/Revival mid 2017: Libido, cock, physique | Sta-kool's Icicle Diary Vol. 5
I know I could be wrong here, but it seems like everyone who has gained a good amount of girth or is gaining girth also experiences discoloration. Intensity is what brings this about. I hate to advocate intense exercises but I am thinking it is the only way to gaining girth. I would gladly take a bigger size with discoloration if it is the only route. I think this was the only thing ever holding me back. Quite frankly I just don’t care anymore about discoloration.
In search of a perfect body, penis, and girl.
The search NO longer continues. :)
My erections are back and I got morning wood the past two days. I will return to length gaining routines (possibly with an ADS) until I hit my ultimate goal (about .5” more to go), then get on some clamping. These recent posts in other forums are really convincing me to clamp.