My buddy Dr Kaplan

So it is convenient to accept the medical profession on this subject then? The challenge to the pumpers is a good test if anyone wants to try it.

The rest of your science I’m not buying. Your tunica is expandable to a slight degree and even moreso when the expansion is spread across a large area. If the tunica was as hard as you say it is, your dick would be like a piece of crystal and not flexible in the slightest when hard. Pretty dangerous condition when you are slamming away.

Have you pumped before? Do you realize that it is pretty damn hard to keep an erection while in the tube?

No problem… We are all learning and I think your experience is very good for us to hear, it reminds me of a guy here in the pumping forum named Peter Sellers who also used high pressure and received all the bad results that go with that. These experiences help us all to learn how NOT to pump.
Low pressure, for short periods over a long period seem to be optimal for most guys to make gains.
ALL PE techniques have pros and cons and proper safety measures, it is good for all of us to have knowledge of these.

Comparing your experience up next to avocet8 and peforeal helps us learn what is and what is not good pumping techniques to make gains and how to effectively glean benefits from pumping if we decide to incorporate it into our routine.

I can only attest to the pumping I have done over the last couple of months and the great benefits I have seen in a short period. Much harder erections and morning (and all through the night) wood, more prominent vascularity, great flacid hang (I NEVER turtle anymore, ever) and the best of all, girth gains (1/4 inch). That is what I have experienced following the advice given by avocet8, peforeal and the other guys in the pumpers forum.

Wad,

Medical professionals, and urologists in particular, state that there is NO, NONE, NADDA, way to make your penis bigger. But you have in-fact done that, correct?

So why believe them about pumping when you know they are not correct about PE? I have not heard of any medical person endorsing or stating that PE works. So, if I use your theory, we are (myself include) delusional because our penises can’t grow.

All I know, is when I get into the tube on the first set, my dick has no water retention (couldn’t have happened yet), it fills (internally) to the same size it would while doing a jelq.

Wad, you should really try pumping for yourself and then decide.

fubar,
I’ve acknowledged the docs negative views of PE in general. What I honestly think is that they’re not even aware of our techniques. Some have heard of manual PE and probably dismissed it based on theory alone (who knows, perhaps because of their findings regarding vacuum pumps).

These urologists do have some background in vacuum pumps, as these pumps have often been recommended to guys with ED, severe diabetics and those with other conditions. The common RX was to pump with the cock ring on to maintain an erection - which the docs agree the pumps are good for. They simply say that permanent size gains cannot be achieved with those pumps.

And Kaplan’s own dodging of independent studies sure looks bad, don’t you agree? This guy is basically the father of the vacuum pumps and even he doesn’t want the pump put to the test regarding questions of permanence (or I am the only one who got that?).

Also, to the FDA’s credit, they have been working to put together a comprehensive study regarding pumps and permanence - which the reluctant Kaplan had finally been cornered into (it was either that for face FDA action regarding his advertising claims).

Thunder,
I’ve never pumped, so I am NOT speaking from any personal experience. But I’ve also read disgruntled pumpers here who’ve gained so very little after a long time of pumping - in addition to other PE.

And, to me, the physiological explanation for growth via manual PE is far more convincing than that of vacuum pumping. And, by the way, the tunica IS extremely tough. That doctor I’m friends with told me that’s why she doesn’t believe that any PE is possible; and informed me that she’s dissected tunicae and studied the tissues microscopically. I would agree that the tunica makes PE a tough endeavor (so does stubborn ligs).

When I’m edging, my unit is so hard I can barely perform a uli - and when doing so, my cock feels like it’s going to explode. I don’t believe that any amount of vacuum pressure could possibly expand it further by 10% or 5% - if it looked bigger it would be because of the fluid buildup. That’s not “penis enlargement,” it’s penis “swelling.” And I suspect that no amount of repetition of said act will result in permanent gains.

I’m not against the act of pumping - it might be fun. One guy said that his girlfriend loved to have sex with him out of the tube, and had mad orgasms. That’s certainly a valid reason to pump. I just don’t have 20 years to waste chasing phantom gains.

Funny that no mention of Kaplan doing testing in connection with the FDA showed up on a FDA site search. I’m not going to argue with you Wad. You believe what you want to believe and I will believe what I want to believe. I have pumped.

I have only toyed with puming before I became a dedicated hanger. Although I don’t have much faith in pumping, I cannot totally dismiss its potential for gains either.

Guys like me have to weigh the expreiences and knowledge of men like Deadeye and Wad against those of Avocet and PeFoReal, for example. Both camps are diametrically opposed. Very difficult to choose.

I agree with Spark’y words because when I was pumping, staying erect made a big difference.

When I could not stay erect, I would compensate by increasing vacuum pressure. My results: fluid build-up and a donut.

Pumping with low vacuum and a good erection seemed the same to me as
a Uli.

oops.
Double post.

How about a turkey joke?

Nah, you’re right. We’ve had enough.

Consider this post as fluid build-up, therefore useless.
Zap away!

Our dear Dr. Kaplan has a Ph.D. in sexology from some obscure university in the states. I have dealt with this Charlatan for a couple of years. Unfortunately you are correct all wants to do is to collect your money a go laughing all the way to the bank. Dr. Kaplan is full of the brown stuff. I found out the less I had to do with him the richer I became.

I thought Dr K was some PhD doctor god. I didnt know his PhD was in sexology. Now I think he is a fraud and a goof.

Good luck finding the “university”.

I read that Kaplan “would be” participating in a research study with the FDA, “finally.” This was allegedly to settle the question since the FDA was accusing Kaplan of false advertising.

You say that you have pumped. Did you achieve noteworthy and permanent gains from pumping exclusively?

First of all, Joel Kaplan is no PhD of “sexology”, or whatever, he’s an MD.
http://www.acce ssdata.fda.gov/ … rchive.cfm?FL=K

Here is a PDF of warning letter the FDA sent to Kaplan:

FDA document regarding penile devices, including patient handout on vacuum pumping & constriction rings (should be read if you do either):

Wad,

Yes I did. I gained girth from pumping, and I didn’t lose it after stopping for over a month, long before I had a clue how to jelq, or any other exercise for that matter.

I’m not sure that first link is any proof that Kaplan is an MD, could just be a mistake in the data entry. The first and second link end up in the same place. The only mention of Kaplan on the FDA website that I had found earlier. I am pretty sure that if he were an MD, he would be including his medical school info on his sites.

5000 guys in lets say “Minnesota” get a licence to deer hunt. Out of those 5000, lets say, only 500 get a 12 point buck.

4500 say they didn’t get a 12 point buck, 500 say they did.

Does the statement of the 500 indicate they are lying, just because the 4500 stated otherwise?

Obviously not.

Wad, what we are taking issue with you is your unequivocal statement that pumping doesn’t work.

There are at least several respected members here who say it has worked for them. They have NEVER claimed that those who haven’t gotten results are lying, or are wrong. They are merely relating their personal experience, that they have.

To someone who isn’t blinded by a set in stone bias, it should be obvious that pumping CAN work, but it obviously hasn’t worked for everyone.

If you were to state that you believe other forms of PE are more effective for a greater percentage of people, the discussion would end…because that is a reasonable statement (may not be accurate, though).

For you to state that it doesn’t/can’t work, I would have to assume you, who have not pumped, has greater authority on the subject than, or lets say, Avocet, who has pumped for years.

Avocet has claimed to have made excellent gains (many others also make this claim) from pumping alone.

You tell me…whom do YOU think WE should consider to be giving valid information, verses just an opinion presented as a fact?

From a physics point of view, force is force. Whether it is generated by a hand or a pump. The only question is in proper application of that force to achieve the end result.

If you believe PE can work, then you are admitting that proper application of force can create a net expansion of the volumn of the penis.

Further, you MUST admit that not everyone is successful in there PE attempts, or at least people have varying degrees of success with their PE….right?

So, if you admit to the above, then the obvious conclusion is generating forces, properly applied to the penis CAN cause expansion to the penis, however there is a factor of appropriate application, and the variable of subject response.

Where does pumping violate any of those parameters? It generates a force… that can be applied to the penis…which can cause expansion. It is also subject to proper application and subject response.

The pumpers forum is filled with articulate, intelligent people (as I find most of Thunders Place) who have made the study of proper application and subject response their area of study and experimentation.

I might add with a reasonable percentage of success and reproducibility, at least reasonable for PE.

When I first started with PE, I studied all the forums. Maybe I missed something you found. I didn’t find any one single method of PE where EVERYONE was writing in saying that WITHOUT FAIL they were getting success….did you?

Its also telling to me that you use the MDs to validate your position about pumping being ineffective, yet their postion is ALL PE is ineffective. If you use them as validation, it nullifies your position that you have achieved success with other techniques, making YOURSELF an invalid source of information.

Every technique seems to have a percentage of success and failure. If I missed the 100% success rate technique, please write it in your response, because I’m here for a bigger dick…not to “sell” a particular technique.

Not many people can hit a dime at 100 yds with a rifle shot…that is a reasonable statement.

To say it CAN’T be done, is just flat out WRONG!

Sparkyx