Loading, lengthening, healing.

Yeah, I know of such cases… where guys did literally everything they could, have been on various types of routines etc. for years.. and gained 0…

Yet, get another guy that knows how to grow ear lobes (don’t know what that stuff is called), let him work on the non-gainer’s ear to enlarge his lobe and
I guarantee to you - he will succeed. That non gainer PE-guy will make ear-lobe “gains”.
Another thing comparable to PE - braces to straighten out teeth. Works on all humanity, I have never heard there is a % it does not work on!!

Since that is the case, it is very hard for me to believe that it is impossible for some.
I cannot believe that.
Even if they go through ALL routines, be at it for a very long time, be consistent, etc. there must be key factors they are completely ignoring.. something tiny..
Perhaps they are not pulling strong enough, perhaps too weak?
Perhaps they are not taking enough off days, perhaps to many?
Soo many factors, you really cant just say/conclude - “ok, that guy tried it all (according to his progress log - his word) and did not gain - I guess there are cases where people do not gain.”

Nope. I mean I do not believe you can.
You can say and believe whatever you want!

I for one believe that there are no boundaries - as long as man can imagine it, he can do it.

When it comes to believing, for instance the starter of this thread never seemed to believe that there could even exist a limiting factor as tight septum / dorsal thickening (what ever they like to call it). Yet many still are limited and stuck with it without accurate tools to combat the condition.

Doesn´t really bother that much what anybody believes, what they know is all that matters. Starter of this thread seemed to know much more than he believed anyways and I have thankfully adopted some of what he knew.

Sure if you have dorsal thickening which is very rare you are pretty much F:ed when it comes to gaining any length.

Interesting numbers man. Your BPFSL-BPEL seems around 0.60”, or 1.5cm. Mine is about 0.35”, or 0.9cm.

My post BPFSL is 19.8cm and it has stayed that way for past 4 sessions. However, my pre BPFSL has gone up from 18.6 to 19cm, while elastic limit has climbed from 19cm to 19.3cm and last session to 19.5cm. So my pre BPFSL has become my old elastic limit basically.

I can’t seem to break through the 19.8cm. It is like a ceiling. Thinking more weight or time. Just time is not very easy with busy life.

I use to hang before but it was BTC and I gained some. Then stopped gaining so stopped hanging. Then resumed after seeing this thread and seem to have gained. Haven’t measured if I still have 0.2mm gain.

My total strain is much higher than yours at 4.2 to 4.8% usually. With creep being 2.6% usually. Within this 2.6% it can also be some elastic strain, because I only do 20min to reach limit. It’s interesting you gained at 2.5-2.8% though. Have you been at PE for a long time? I think you said you tried hanging before, but then you tried heat, and started gaining. How much were your gains before your second attempt at hanging?

I am using a bib hanger now because of blisters. Also can use more weight. I will keep logging.

On my fifth month now and never hanged with weight using only rubbery resistance bands. Maybe not a hanger at all but a stretcher with hangers attachment.
My previous attempts have brought my measurements from shy to a 17cm to solid 18cm. With manual stretching and quite strong ADS. Pumping for few months gave zero gains lenghtwise but did give some girth gains.
BPFSL never got more than BPEL.
I recall the big difference now seems to be taking everything out of stress relaxation phenomenon before introducing heat and heavier stretches.
I have brake it down a little bit on my progress log and I will keep logging those working based BPFSL numbers to be posted there in future too.

As I said before my measures mentioned are taken out of stretcher a seconds after releasing vac head. Maybe my percentages should be larger too when using open head style hanger attachment then could be measured while continuous tension?

You know what’s really funny for me, after posting my last post yesterday I went out on that evening to drink with some friends and we were talking the exact same thing with the percentage of people on this planet that can’t contribute positively to the rest of society and are probably making everything worse, etc. But it wasn’t PE related…

About the guys that say they never gain, IMO that doesn’t exist…I mean, we are plastically deforming it, how could that not work for everyone? It’s not so much of a sport and genes and DNA could have nothing to do with it…just sayin, it may have something to do with it, but still, it still doesn’t explain it for me how some people just can’t gain after trying out every exercise “correctly”…

This is a great thread BTW

Don’t remember mentioning this, after using heat in my first sets I can hold heavier sets for longer and just simply applying heat before I stretch my unit in the morning will give me a milimetrically longer bpfsl.

Also, I forgot to mention this…Last year when I first came across these forums(thunders, pegym, mos), I was mostly finding articles everywhere even on reddit from guys who were explaining in very LONG posts how this PE is BS and couldn’t possibly work and that it’s a scam, etc….I actually was buying that sh… because of how LOONG and emotional the posts were, but not entirely though….IMO it’s like if PE wouldn’t work it would mean the human body is stronger than gravity and Earth’s forces together…I think it’s very much like thoughtfulgold said about our state of mind and our openness to the subject, if some people are skeptical in practicing it I’m certain that will hinder gains, but could STILL probably make some either way…especially when hanging which IMO is the REALEST and most obvious of all methods.

I read your progress log. Interesting you gained girth too.

I’m using IR lamp. I wonder if US is better. Do you feel the heat inside on your cord with US?

My IR lamp heats everything. But I measured with thermometer outside temp is like 40-41°. Not sure about inside on cord.

I measure out of bib hanger just by manual pull. I think is more consistent that way.

I recall reading that at plateau stress relaxation higher temperature stress relax even further.

I’ve been trying to find a study of histeresys and cyclic loading. Apparently after 10 cycles the histerys becomes reproducible for tendon. Strain increasing each cycle. However 10 sets is quite a lot. If say at 3 sets there starts to be diminishing creep gains then 3 sets would be the best, in a minimalistic sense. I’m currently doing 2 sets of 20min. But based on this concept 4 sets of 10 min would take advantage of histeresys and optimize creep gains. Also I recall reading stress relaxation plateaus at 17min at 37°. Perhaps 1 20min set followed by 2 10 min sets would be optimal.

This study seems interesting but cant access it
Temperature dependent behavior of the canine medial collateral ligament

Same observations are mentioned all over at Thunders. I can confirm what you have seen.

The heat is felt inside very early, but without extra heat source like rice sock it is hard to get whole shaft heated enough with 1.6 w/ cm^2 US power. More powerfull machine would be better.

Introducing heat brings more stress relaxation for sure.

I have read that too. If we are talking about same study it only goes for cyclic stretching. When maintaining continuous stretch for a longer time it does not plateau so early. That is one reason to keep it relaxing for 60min . I have tried 90 min but it gives nothing more to it.

Decided to post this here. I’ve been reading Saiyan22 s log on pegym for some time now and he says, along with other guys, that EQ should be our guide when hanging…Maybe I’ve been overtraining lately as I have been hanging almost everyday, 3-4 days with my highest weights each week at least and 2-3 with lower weights(my EQ has been pretty bad like 8 out of 10, but could get a 10 with lots of stimulation), I think from time to time this is good to break a plateau, but I kind of get the feeling there are more stages of plateau and some may be better to take time off or even start taking days off as part of the routine. I spent 4 days with almost no hanging except 2 20min sets with 0,5kg, what I call ADH, and I seem to get back on track this way and hang more sets comfortably…

I can hang 4,5kg for one hour maybe in 20min sets, should I start with 5kg and less sets??

I do 2-4 sets with 0,5kg and raise gradually to 3kg, 2-4sets with 4-4,5kg, 1-3sets with low weights again, I sometimes do this twice a day summing up a total of 3-4hours hanging time. I hang over 15hours each week, except this last one with my 4 days off….thinking of starting SO or Upwards hanging, or maybe bundled hanging? or maybe bundled SO hanging? I can’t find a good way to go on from now on as I can’t really break 24cm bpfsl for a longer time with my current BTC and SD routine, but I still get good PI;s, I still get flaccid gains, measurable bpel bpfsl gains ocasionally, never turtle, stopped jelqing for longer than 10min to maximize length gains(not sure if it’s a good idea, jelqing was good to me along with hanging)….

I was having a hard time breaking 19.8cm. Then last two sessions I managed to break through. I was doing 2 sets before. 20min each. Then I tried 3 sets. Day before yesterday = 1st set 4.7 kg. 2nd set 5.7kg and last 5.7. However, 1st and 2nd were targeting left ventral cord. Last set I did right ventral cord, which felt like it had more give after 1st two sets. Then I reached 20cm. Then yesterday, my pre bpfsl went from 18.9 to 19.5, new high. Elastic limit was then 19.9cm, a 0.4 gain from prior days. 1st set 4.7kg, 2nd set 5.2kg, and third set 5.7. 1st set left ventral cord. 2nd set right ventral cord. Last set 10min each both ventral alternating. Then I reached new limit of 20.3cm. I used fulcrums and heat.

I think your peak weight should be used to hit new cap BPFSL like I did 5.7kg to reach 20.3 new limit. Then next days you can hang at lower weight, say 5.2kg or less, so long as your new cap is mantained at 20.3 and cemented for a week or so until you heal the new limit. After a week try 5.7kg again. If your limit after few hanging sessions is still e.g 20.3, then you increase the weight. I am thinking e.g. 1st set 5.2kg, then 2nd set 5.7kg, then third is new peak weight of 6.2kg. Then see if new BPFSL limit is reached. If so, then you can lower to 5.2 or 5.7etc and cement again, repeat process.

As you mentioned, EQ is important because today I am very bad EQ and even lost some BPEL, but new BPFSL records, I think in a week I will see new BPEL levels. I think on bad EQ days maybe try wearing ADS for an hour atleast, to keep the extension. I also do manual stretches using my other arm as a fulcrum every time I go to the bathroom. This keeps it at the elastic limit all day I think while the repair/healing/etc is going on.

Also with new BPFSL gains, your soft tissue may need to expand to new BPFLS limit. For this you can do some girth work perhaps, to expand the smooth muscle, and achieve the new BPEL. This is based on the theory I can’t remember the name. But if BPFSL is 0.50” higher than BPEL, then you are limited by the smooth muscle development, and not tunica anymore. If less than 0.50” you need to increase BPFSL by hanging/stretching/etc.

Hope that helps.

Yes it does, thanks a lot!

I am glad to see you are thinking similar to me in many aspects. It gives a confidence to push further.

TGC theory is what they called it. Interestingly there is disclaimer wrote in red in the first post stating that the theory is not proven. I find it very very doubtful as non of these “theories” claimed here are not proven in any scientific fashion. Yeah it includes few flaws but in general contains some very important aspects. I think every “theory” here should contain similar notes. Maybe they have already since I have not checked out.

I am going for it as I am going to introduce girth orientated exercises to catch up the difference in BPEL and BPFSL.
Which is at the moment 1.7cm and my EQ has dropped. I already did few 10 mins sets of pumping and 5min sets of clamping and EQ is coming better.
Lets see is BPEL is going to grow as there should be plenty of room now tunica and septum have stretched a lot.

Does measuring bpfsl with all the hanging wraps on give a bonus length from the compression?

Are you saying that in order to gain further bpfsl one should do girth/length work at low erec. levels so he can catch up with bpel? That’s how the TGC theory goes…I really think there is some truth to this idea, maybe at some point girth work should be a must do for any length deformation process, I’m really stoked about saiyan22’s length and girth gains, also there are a few other great gainers that eventually turned to jelqing/squeezing at some point in their length pursuite…but length before girth is still considered to be a general routine for best results.