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Originally Posted by train spot
Does measuring bpfsl with all the hanging wraps on give a bonus length from the compression?

In my experience yes, but it is rather negligible. Maybe 1mm difference.


Genesis 2006 = 5.8" x 4.7" /// Round 3 2019: Hanging again = 7.99" x 5.5" /// ST Goal 2019 = 8" x 6" /// End Game 2020 = 9" x 6.5"

Originally Posted by Kyrpa
TGC theory is what they called it. Interestingly there is disclaimer wrote in red in the first post stating that the theory is not proven. I find it very very doubtful as non of these “theories” claimed here are not proven in any scientific fashion. Yeah it includes few flaws but in general contains some very important aspects. I think every “theory” here should contain similar notes. Maybe they have already since I have not checked out.

I am going for it as I am going to introduce girth orientated exercises to catch up the difference in BPEL and BPFSL.
Which is at the moment 1.7cm and my EQ has dropped. I already did few 10 mins sets of pumping and 5min sets of clamping and EQ is coming better.
Lets see is BPEL is going to grow as there should be plenty of room now tunica and septum have stretched a lot.

Yes, TGC, thank you for that.

Usually when my BPFSL-BPEL is > average historical BPFSL-BPEL, I have some room to grow, and doing soft tissue work helps fill that space, followed by increase in BPEL and back to average historical BPFSL-BPEL.


Genesis 2006 = 5.8" x 4.7" /// Round 3 2019: Hanging again = 7.99" x 5.5" /// ST Goal 2019 = 8" x 6" /// End Game 2020 = 9" x 6.5"

Originally Posted by train spot
Are you saying that in order to gain further bpfsl one should do girth/length work at low erec. levels so he can catch up with bpel? That’s how the TGC theory goes…I really think there is some truth to this idea, maybe at some point girth work should be a must do for any length deformation process, I’m really stoked about saiyan22’s length and girth gains, also there are a few other great gainers that eventually turned to jelqing/squeezing at some point in their length pursuite…but length before girth is still considered to be a general routine for best results.

I am not sure about that. I think you can gain more BPFSL without girth work, to the extend you even increase your average historical BPFSL-BPEL. But to gain BPEL I believe you need to do girth work to fill the new space, soft tissue, as TGC suggests.

It also may be more optimal to catch up BPEL before you increase BPFSL. Or maybe not. This is the debate length before girth, etc. I have gained BPEL from doing girth work. So I believe TGC holds true. Also length stopped when BPFSL aproximated BPEL for me. And now I have more BPFSL, and I got more BPEL. So I believe the theory holds.

I am not that familiar with saiyan22. I think he was banned for some reason. I can’t exactly summarize his routine/protocol.. or any take aways from his experience. I remember he hangs upside angle though, which I thought was interesting.


Genesis 2006 = 5.8" x 4.7" /// Round 3 2019: Hanging again = 7.99" x 5.5" /// ST Goal 2019 = 8" x 6" /// End Game 2020 = 9" x 6.5"

He has done pumping/clamping/hanging sort of like in this order. He started hanging SO and Upwards from the beginning and eventually started bundled SO and up and bundled down hanging angles, he gained over 1,5 inches a in 2-3 years maybe, and a lot in girth, his last pics from 2014 were with 9,7nbpel permanent length and 7mseg 7+base girth etc after pumping/clamping, so about 6,5inches permanent girth..he started out at 8nbpel and 5mseg in 2008. He stopped posting, was banned from this forum because of trying to sell something fraud like and said something about already having a kid in 2014 so he must have some more responsabilities now so he doesn’t have the time or need for more PE..I read most of his writings on Pegym, he was also posting here but I haven’t bothered to read them. He is an inspiration to me and by far the most consistent amount of info gathered about hanging was from his threads and Bib. He was more of an inspiration to me rather than Bib because he provided lots of photos and routines, while Bib did not do so, and he was a bodybuilder like myself also.

I’ve been reading his thread on pegym. As far as bundled hanging and girth is concerned it seems he only gained 0.1” in girth. At the time he was 5.8”. But then he was banned and went to MOS as snakeking or something. One year later he posted again in pegym and he was 6.25”. I cant find what his routine was during this year of about 0.5” girth gain.. but it sounds like he did something interesting to break that 5.8” plateau he was for a long time. Would you know what it is?


Genesis 2006 = 5.8" x 4.7" /// Round 3 2019: Hanging again = 7.99" x 5.5" /// ST Goal 2019 = 8" x 6" /// End Game 2020 = 9" x 6.5"

Originally Posted by manko007
I’ve been reading his thread on pegym. As far as bundled hanging and girth is concerned it seems he only gained 0.1” in girth. At the time he was 5.8”. But then he was banned and went to MOS as snakeking or something. One year later he posted again in pegym and he was 6.25”. I cant find what his routine was during this year of about 0.5” girth gain.. but it sounds like he did something interesting to break that 5.8” plateau he was for a long time. Would you know what it is?

I think very heavy 30lbs hanging. He had a whole theory on how very heavy hanging created uniform girth.

Reading his pegym thread you can’t tell what was the best thing he had done for plateau breaking, girth/length gaining because he was doing everything simultaneously.

He did say he reached over 20 lbs eventually with normal hanging, but he was very into that bundled aspect of hanging, and the SO/Upward/Tunica fulcrum bundled hanging.

So I found it, apparently this is what he did:

“Just 3 months ago my dry midgirth was 5.8 inches which is a .3 increase to 6.1 inches now. I think the main thing that has increased my girth is the use of my silicone sleeve for 6 to 10 hours a day to keep engorgement in between my Penis Enlargement sessions.”

And during the 3 months he gained that he did:

“I now do my girth work which is as follows. 5 minutes of bundled stretches then 10 to 15 minutes of slow jelqs with an 80 to 90% erection. I only jelq about 2 to 3 inches up the shaft from the base but kegel hard which pushes a shit ton of blood up my shaft inflating the glans. While jelqing I’ll sometimes do erect bends to hit the tunica at specific areas.

After that I do a 15 minute intense clamping set. After that I do one 15 minute pumping set to restore erection quality while stretching the tunica from the glans all the way into the base. After my pumping set, I edge for 10 minutes to help restore normal circulation and penile health.

I’ve been hitting my clamping sessions and bundled work hard for girth gains and so far so good. Girth is coming along slowly. I’ve come a long way now at 6.25 inches midgirth.”

Plus all the other stuff he does, like you said, which may have contributed.

I think his clamping technique is very good. He also said bundled hanging only contributed 0.1 to girth from 5.7 to 5.8. And stopped doing it for some reason.

But it seems like he did bundled stretches before girth work and wore that sleeve and that contributed the most apparently.

If you want to find it, it’s in posts 46 through 60 of his main thread in MOS.

He then went into chemical PE and got 6.5” but then 1 year later lost it all back to 6.25”. I think his ending stat for girth is 6.25” in 2012. Fast forward to 2015 and it was still 6.25”. Can’t find anything more since then.


Genesis 2006 = 5.8" x 4.7" /// Round 3 2019: Hanging again = 7.99" x 5.5" /// ST Goal 2019 = 8" x 6" /// End Game 2020 = 9" x 6.5"

He probably stopped PE during 2012-2015, he has some photos right now from 2014-2015 on pegym with 7inches mseg after pumping, he probably would have gained another half of an inch in girth, reading his thread he evolved pretty easily in girth, but he was doing a lot of work dammit…

I also spoke to another good gainer from pegym, MulejuiceMcQuaid, he gained a little over 1,5inches in length hanging 2 years SD, and 0,5girth gain with no girth work. He told me he spent more than 20 hours of hanging each week, he sometimes hanged throughout the night as well, so he said, summing up a total of 4-6hours of hanging almost every day

Reading his posts I wonder how he ever manages to get anything else done.

BTW for those interested, I started a progress log following my current routine which is based off of this threads findings:
Manko007’s road to big dick land


Genesis 2006 = 5.8" x 4.7" /// Round 3 2019: Hanging again = 7.99" x 5.5" /// ST Goal 2019 = 8" x 6" /// End Game 2020 = 9" x 6.5"

Originally Posted by manko007
Reading his posts I wonder how he ever manages to get anything else done.

BTW for those interested, I started a progress log following my current routine which is based off of this threads findings:
Manko007’s road to big dick land


I think he had some mental “issues”of some sort, not judging him, big inspiration, nothing but love for him. But he DID seem to go overboard with the sex stories( :) ) ), not saying that they couldn’t be true or whatever, but that’s how I see it, maybe he did exagerate a bit with all his techniques and time spent doing PE, maybe….


Last edited by train spot : 12-15-2018 at .

Originally Posted by manko007
I am not sure about that. I think you can gain more BPFSL without girth work, to the extend you even increase your average historical BPFSL-BPEL. But to gain BPEL I believe you need to do girth work to fill the new space, soft tissue, as TGC suggests.

It also may be more optimal to catch up BPEL before you increase BPFSL. Or maybe not. This is the debate length before girth, etc. I have gained BPEL from doing girth work. So I believe TGC holds true. Also length stopped when BPFSL aproximated BPEL for me. And now I have more BPFSL, and I got more BPEL. So I believe the theory holds.

I am not that familiar with saiyan22. I think he was banned for some reason. I can’t exactly summarize his routine/protocol.. or any take aways from his experience. I remember he hangs upside angle though, which I thought was interesting.

I dont believe that the TGC theory holds true. Thats because the tunica is always the limiting factor, never the smooth muscle.

I think that the BPFSL will always be bigger than the BPEL because when you measure your stretched flaccid length the expansion is only lengthwise. But when you measure BPEL there is a trade off between length and girth expansion due to the blood inside the CC. Also for example i have an upward curve at high EQ and thats affect my length, but when i measure BPFSL the curve does not exist.

Anyway BPFSL is the best indicator for gains in my opinion because if you are consistent with the way you measure you dont need 100% EQ and differences in EQ does not affect your measurements. Every time i see a gain in BPFSL after some time my BPEL will catch up, but of course there is a delay and it requires some time. Although even when my BPEL catch up there is always an 1 cm difference.

My hypothesis is that the delay happens because there is a new space in CC(length gain) and the body does not know how to fill it yet. So better EQ and EQ improvement exercises will help to manifest the BPFSL gain into a BPEL gain.

And if you are after length and see an increase in BPFSL, it means that things are working and you have to keep doing what are you are doing. If you switch to girth work you may put unnecessary pressure and force to your penis and lose the sweet spot. The smooth muscle will increase as the penis grows. EQ improvement exercises while doing pure length work is always good, like kegels(towel raises) and some jelqs. You dont have to switch to girth work when you have found the sweet spot for length gains and the sweet spot is when you gain BPFSL.

Originally Posted by Gentlepsychopath
My hypothesis is that the delay happens because there is a new space in CC(length gain) and the body does not know how to fill it yet. So better EQ and EQ improvement exercises will help to manifest the BPFSL gain into a BPEL gain.

If you take another look on what you are saying, well isn’t it the TGC after all. Smooth muscle is the factor which hold sinunoids expanding larger to achive better EQ and so to speak fill the space. When contracted SM turtles the CCs by shrinking the sinunoids. Same thing goes opposite for expanding. Not until SM are “trained” to stretch bigger when relaxed or grow bigger or even have more SM cells by hyperplasia. Bigger BPEL or MSEG is achieved if one have filled this way the more roomy expanded tunica.


START 18/13.15 cm Jul 24th 18 (7.09/5.18") NOW 22.5/15.2 cm Fer 12th 20 (8.86/5.98") GOAL 8.5"/ 6"

When connective tissue is stretched within therapeutic temperatures ranging 102 to 110 F (38.9- 43.3 C), the amount of structural weakening produced by a given amount of tissue elongation varies inversely with the temperature. This is apparently related to the progressive increase in the viscous flow properties of the collagenous tissue when it is heated. (Warren et al (1971,1976)

Originally Posted by Kyrpa
If you take another look on what you are saying, well isn’t it the TGC after all. Smooth muscle is the factor which hold sinunoids expanding larger to achive better EQ and so to speak fill the space. When contracted SM turtles the CCs by shrinking the sinunoids. Same thing goes opposite for expanding. Not until SM are “trained” to stretch bigger when relaxed or grow bigger or even have more SM cells by hyperplasia. Bigger BPEL or MSEG is achieved if one have filled this way the more roomy expanded tunica.

Yes you are right. You cant achieve a big penis increase without more smooth muscle.

What i am saying is that the body will fill the gap with time. Maybe the smooth muscle grows as a consequence of the penis growth. In my experience i have never done any girth work and always my BPEL has close the gap with time. This happens after periods with low EQ and maybe reguires some repairing time.

Pushing more blood to the CC with little synergistic EQ exercises maybe 2-3 times a week is enough.

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