Thunder's Place

The big penis and mens' sexual health source, increasing penis size around the world.

Digitally controlled constant strain extender

Originally Posted by Tutt
I think just like all collagenous tissue there is a certain amount of strain that comes from uncrimping and orienting the fibers (aka newbie gains). Then there is a modest amount that is achievable through actual brute force strain prior to the physiological toughening response, after which there will be a plateau that is insurmountable. Together these might equate to around 0.25 to 0.5”. What you are describing to me sounds exactly like the result of chronic edema resulting in tissue fibrosis which would make the CS bulge and feel hard. The CS is not supposed to be hard, and if you have reached the point where it is, you have produced irreparable damage to the tissues. In that sense you have just achieved more girth by recruiting your body to add layers of scar tissue to your shaft. Not very appealing to me personally, but I’m sure that many here would say it’s worth the tradeoff.

That’s now really how Angion method works though. It basically causes supranormal flow rates in the arteries to stimulate arteriogenesis. The stiffening of the CS seems to be due to very high flow rates, like high water pressure stiffening a hose. I’m sure your theory is correct regarding reasons for gain plateaus though. It’s the only one that really makes sense ATM.

That aside, I’m curious about FIR pumping applications. Maybe a similar approach at gradually increasing hg, applying heat, then removing heat and cooling down at a higher hg.

Originally Posted by easygainer
Thanks @Tutt! Appreciate it.

Can you spell out what 0.5% and 1% strain rates ~ translate to in mm/minute.

So I think the Very Fast Dragon Skin isn’t going to work. My first attempt at making the phantom didn’t go well. Will have to order the NV and wait a few weeks again, sigh.

Excited to begin!

Sorry for the stupid question. Do you count the percentage of deformation from the length of the bpfsl or from the maximum load to be applied in one hour? If from the load, then what does the reference point have to do with your length. If from length, why do you need a load calculator? Thank you.


Sorry for my English

And one more question if I may. Is it better to add 1% per minute or 5% every 5 minutes?


Sorry for my English

Originally Posted by easygainer
@fdersby88

I should have bought the NV Dragon Skin…my next mistake was buying the Very Fast…the pot life is only 4 minutes…sigh…it takes so long to receive packages from Amazon so I guess I’ll have to give it a shot.

I’m thinking of pouring it straight into my mold, then using my vacuum cup vacuum over the top of the two pieces of PVC to try to suck out air. I guess the silicone will expand, then I can release the vacuum and give it a few taps. I think I can do all this in 4 minutes. I’m guessing my vacuum cup vacuum is far too weak to do much here. Thoughts?

It happened the same to me the first time, but what I recommend you doing is what ROCCO25 showed me:

US_Phantom_01.png

I recommend you sticking to the DRAGON SKIN 20. It works flawlessly and at the end of the day, there is some bubbles here and there. I do still have some minor bubbles inside the phantom pad but that does not affect my readings that much perhaps 0.1ºC but thats about it.

Neither I feel a burning sensation or pinching like when I tried doing it without the phantom pad.

1 - Cut the bigger diameter pvc pipe in half and clean them.

2 - Pour PART A on a 125ml cup

3 - Pour part b on another 125ml cup

4 - Pour both on a 500ml cup (It its solid metal or something that can not deform under vaccum would be better)

5 - Stir it for 1min

6 - Put a lid on top of the 500ml cup (With a drill on the top) sealed with bluetak (Its cheap and works)

7 - Connect a male hose to the hole on the top, after that connect it to the vaccum brake bleeder and pump all the possible air out. The maximum vaccum I could do was 22 inHG and it removed most of the bubbles but some remained inside. Careful here, it WILL EXPAND!! so make sure to have enough room in the jar/cup

[Perhaps if you live closer to the sea level you could achieve more inHG?]

8 - Pour the mixed silicone solution on the Bigger pvc pipe and put the smaller diameter PVC pipe on top of the silicone, then proceed to put something on top of it or a clamp perhaps, just to make enough pressure on top of it so it does not move.

9 - Let it rest for 12 hours (Even though it takes less time, more time Its not going to hurt the mix)

10 - Remove the smaller diameter pvc pipe on top, and after that remove your brand new DRAGON SKIN phantom pad.

Originally Posted by RedCommander
I’ve found your thoughts on heated hanging very enlightening.

Do you really think that all the 1”+ girth gainers out there are just edema? I’ve encountered a number of clampers and pumpers that have added serious mass and have maintained their size indefinitely (multiple years). I feel like if it was just simple edema they would fade quite quickly and would not provide normal hard erections. I’m not sure I agree with that assessment based on what I’ve seen here and other PE forums. Perhaps there is another mechanism at play here that is not obvious? I don’t think the girth puzzle has had as much progress as length and there is a lot to still uncover there.

As an aside, practitioners of Angion Method who graduate to the wheel (check out the angion subbreddit if you’re interested) actually develop a very firm CS that can take on an almost bulbous appearance as the arteries enlarge and thicken. It’s a very interesting adaptation.

Have you seen this critique of the Angion Methods?

A medical review of the Angion Method : AJelqForYou

Originally Posted by fdersby88
It happened the same to me the first time, but what I recommend you doing is what ROCCO25 showed me:

US_Phantom_01.png

I recommend you sticking to the DRAGON SKIN 20. It works flawlessly and at the end of the day, there is some bubbles here and there. I do still have some minor bubbles inside the phantom pad but that does not affect my readings that much perhaps 0.1ºC but thats about it.

Neither I feel a burning sensation or pinching like when I tried doing it without the phantom pad.

1 - Cut the bigger diameter pvc pipe in half and clean them.

2 - Pour PART A on a 125ml cup

3 - Pour part b on another 125ml cup

4 - Pour both on a 500ml cup (It its solid metal or something that can not deform under vaccum would be better)

5 - Stir it for 1min

6 - Put a lid on top of the 500ml cup (With a drill on the top) sealed with bluetak (Its cheap and works)

7 - Connect a male hose to the hole on the top, after that connect it to the vaccum brake bleeder and pump all the possible air out. The maximum vaccum I could do was 22 inHG and it removed most of the bubbles but some remained inside. Careful here, it WILL EXPAND!! so make sure to have enough room in the jar/cup

[Perhaps if you live closer to the sea level you could achieve more inHG?]

8 - Pour the mixed silicone solution on the Bigger pvc pipe and put the smaller diameter PVC pipe on top of the silicone, then proceed to put something on top of it or a clamp perhaps, just to make enough pressure on top of it so it does not move.

9 - Let it rest for 12 hours (Even though it takes less time, more time Its not going to hurt the mix)

10 - Remove the smaller diameter pvc pipe on top, and after that remove your brand new DRAGON SKIN phantom pad.

Thank you so much for the detailed instructions @fdersby88. I’ll definitely use some of the ideas here for when my NV arrives. NV means no vacuum so apparently you don’t need a vacuum for that mix. I don’t think I can use the current one I have with your above instructions because the pot life is just 4 minutes. The instructions says to mix parts A and B for 3 minutes. I mixed for just 2 minutes to buy myself some time and while pouring into my mold it started to harden and stopped pouring. Lol. It was an utter disaster. Within 30 minutes it had fully cured and I was trying to remove it from my mold. They weren’t kidding when they labelled it ‘Very Fast’.

Originally Posted by Holdion
Sorry for the stupid question. Do you count the percentage of deformation from the length of the bpfsl or from the maximum load to be applied in one hour? If from the load, then what does the reference point have to do with your length. If from length, why do you need a load calculator? Thank you.

Tutt suggests not using BPFSL because the way that’s traditionally measured is essentially an uncontrolled strain (meaning a fast strain rate and an arbritary load) which may inevitably induce toughening.

Instead, if I understood Tutt’s suggestions correctly, what we’re doing is this:
1) Measure your length at 1kg which would have been approached at a very slow strain rate in an precision device (so approached at 1.5-2mm per minute) - this will act as your BPFSL
2) Then measure your length at the peak of your routine, i.e. your max length ~ an hour into your routine - right before you remove heat and deload - also approached at a slow strain rate by your device (e.g. <1mm/min) - this acts as your post-BPFSL

Then you calculate strain.

In terms of reference points on the penis, see attached. You’re measuring inside your device, so right in front of the plastic pubic ring of your extender (i.e. not the part laying on your pubic area), to some point at the tip of your penis. It could be the tip of your penis itself but the swelling of the glans from the vacuum cup pressure might cause variance, or some permanent point right beneath the corona. The point is to be consistent with whatever you choose so that you can make comparisons between sessions.

I think a method like above should give you a fairly accurate estimate of true strain - at least accurate enough to let you know if you’re in the 3-5% growth range. More importantly, if you’re consistent with your method, you can see how that % is reducing across sessions to indicate when a decon is needed. I think this is the true benefit.

@Tutt
Can you kindly confirm the above?

Your other question:
“And one more question if I may. Is it better to add 1% per minute or 5% every 5 minutes?”

I’m not sure what you mean by this to be honest. Can you re-phrase the question?

If you mean adding small amounts of weight every minute or larger weights every 5 minutes then I think you’re missing a huge assumption both Tutt and I are making here. We’re both assuming that you’re using a precision device that’s capable of really slow strain rates as low <1mm/minute. Your vacuum cup should also be blocked to ensure a stress-relaxation instead of a creep protocol. I’ll post a video of my final device today then info for anyone who wants to build it. I’ll also write up a step by step of what the routine will look like and hopefully @Tutt can critique it to confirm or correct parts.

Strain.png
(59.6 KB, 72 views)

Originally Posted by easygainer
Have you seen this critique of the Angion Methods?

A medical review of the Angion Method : AJelqForYou

Yes, I’ve read the critique. It’s a lot of words with very little substance. The poster doesn’t really provide concrete logic for why AM doesn’t work; it’s just a lot of fuzzy language and reads more like an opinion piece than anything objective and doesn’t provide a material rebuttal of anything.

Here is a video demonstration of my device. It was raining heavily hence the background noise.

Disclaimer - I don’t want my voice tied to the forum, so I didn’t speak in the video.

A few things to point out:
Buttons 1 and 2 are the main buttons to be used in the therapy sessions and elongate at 0.85mm and 1.5mm per minute respectively. I can easily reprogram these buttons and rate as needed. These speeds are a bit too slow to see with the naked eye over the few seconds they’re demonstrated in the video though.

Buttons 3 and 4 are the fastest speeds I can attain with the constraints of how the driver is necessarily wired. If you look at the platform onto which the fish scale is strapped, you can see the subtle movement. Both move at 30mm per minute and these buttons are primarily to position the cup as needed to set up before beginning the exercise and to deload after removing the heat. At 2:10 in the video, I apply some force to the vacuum cup to show that at 0.85mm/minute, it has plenty of torque to pull 3.7kg of load. It could probably do a bit more as it’s very strong but 3.7kg already has some margin/extra strength compared to what I’ll need.

If anyone is interested in how to build it, let me know. It’s fairly modular. You can just buy the parts (not from me) and screw everything together. I’ll happy provide the code I used for the motor that I hired a programmer to write, free of charge.

Oh - the hinges of my total man extender arrived broken. They did not survive shipping, so I made two wooden hinges for now until my replacements arrive. Michael from the totalman website is sending replacements free of charge so I’m pretty satisfied with the service.

A few pros and cons:
Pros:
-Very solid build - should last a lifetime
-Essentially modular - you buy and screw together the parts (with a few exceptions)
-Using a lead screw build like mine is relatively cheap vs a precision micrometer linear stage like @Tutt…when I priced it, his linear stage alone costs ~$200. I have to finalize the price of mine but most of the parts (minus the lead screw, Nema17, and tools I bought) plus shipping came up to $181.20
-Programmable - at this point, I can just strap in, and push the 4 buttons as needed to execute the therapy. I can reprogram the buttons if we discover more optimal speeds, etc
-It’s fun to build - you will need to solder some things together and wire up the electronic components. I’ve never soldered or wired anything before but figured it out with a few YouTube videos…wasn’t hard at all…kinda fun actually and it feels good once it works in the end
-The two pillars blocking the vacuum cup makes this a stress-relaxation protocol (as opposed to creep) - hence strain rate is controlled
-A 1:7 gear ratio, plus a 1mm lead screw means I can hit super slow speeds if needed with plenty of torque, probably more than we need
-I bought an extra collar which I can fasten anywhere along the lead screw as a redundancy to limit how far the entire platform with the fish scale and vacuum cup can travel. Let’s say for some reason the motor malfunctions and speeds up, it can block the travel to not tear out my penis…lol…the fastest speed I think it can do is about 30mm/min though so plenty of time to stop/unplug things
-You have access to your shaft both dorsally and ventrally, perfect for fitting your silicone phantom and US device for heating

Cons:
-Stepper motors vibrate a lot. If I place my device on a soft surface like my bed, it’s essentially silent - but I would feel the subtle vibrations in my penis (haven’t used it yet but I feel it in my hands when holding the device). If I placed it on my desk, I could hear the vibrations
-Finding a 1mm pitch lead screw online is kinda tough. I got mine from ebay and the quality isn’t great. It works perfectly for me after lubing it up with WD-40 but it still isn’t as smooth as it should be for a lead screw
-While mostly modular, you would probably need a drill and a jigsaw (or hacksaw) to widen some holes and cut one of the frame channels. You will also need a soldering set
-A bit heavy - my entire setup weighs a little under 2lbs I estimate. That doesn’t really matter since we should be sitting during these sessions anyway
-Uses a 5v and 12v power source, so 2 adapters needs to be plugged in - this plus your ultrasound device means 3 sockets are needed

The mods asked me to upload my files to the forum for longevity (vs links) which I’ll do shortly in a reply. In the meantime, sharing this link is easier: https://drive.google.com/file/ … iew?usp=sharing

I’m thinking of whether I can build a device to strap in the US Pro 2000 to automatically move along the shaft to make that hands-free too

Originally Posted by RedCommander
Yes, I’ve read the critique. It’s a lot of words with very little substance. The poster doesn’t really provide concrete logic for why AM doesn’t work; it’s just a lot of fuzzy language and reads more like an opinion piece than anything objective and doesn’t provide a material rebuttal of anything.

Duly noted. Genuine question here - has Janus linked to any research to support the premises of this method?

@32quarters

I tried uploading the video to the forum twice. Took some time then timed-out/closed the connection. Any suggestions?

Oh, one huge advantage over a precision linear stage design is that such a linear stage will allow precise movements for an inch or two only, so you’d have to set up your device perfectly so that you only draw on the linear stage during the last 1-2 inches of elongation during your session.

My design on the other hand allows precise movement over the entire range. That’s about 5 inches with my current selection of components. If you wanted more travel, you’d just have to swap for a longer lead screw and rail.

Not sure how to edit posts but I should point out that Tutt’s device was the inspiration for this build. That said, Tutt built his device from stuff he had lying around, hence his choice of a linear stage - it was available. So in my last post, the apparent advantage of my design over a linear stage like the one is used is not me trying to boast or say that my build is necessarily superior. It’s literally a case of my design vs him using what he had lying around and not necessarily his best engineering skills. So not trying to say my device is necessarily superior or the best, etc - just another option that does the same things.

I just don’t want to offend anyone and I greatly appreciate the generous contributions of Tutt and others alike which is the foundation of my build and my protocol moving forward.

Originally Posted by easygainer
Duly noted. Genuine question here - has Janus linked to any research to support the premises of this method?

Not that I am aware of, but given the nature of PE, there is very little science behind any of this. Mostly trial and error with a lot of theory, but for some reason a higher standard is placed on claims from Janus even though most of this is still bro science.

However, the FIRE theory of hanging is the most revolutionary development in a long time and actually relies on studies of similar tissue as its foundation. The speed that practitioners are able to gain significant length is nothing short of astonishing, and I can’t wait to see a similar breakthrough occur in our understanding of girth gains. I am also a huge fan of the source of gains being the shaft rather than the ligaments, as I don’t think LOT is completely dead and loose ligaments aren’t very desirable IMO.

As far as AM goes, if it truly does follow bodybuilding principles then it is a very slow method of gaining. Janus’ whole purpose was to develop a safer alternative to traditional PE that could still yield results. Substantial muscle growth takes a long time, so it’s not illogical to believe that the penis would also take a long time based on a methodology that relies on the same principles, and lurking on the AM subreddits, it seems to take a while for members to lay enough foundation for growth to occur.

I’ve read through his documentation and watched his theory videos, and the logic seems sound. When practicing his method I can absolutely notice improved EQ almost right away, but I have been focused on traditional PE because AM is more focused on girth than length, and I want my 7.5 NBP measurement in a reasonable time-frame. Additionally, the quality of this forum is light-years beyond Reddit, which consists mostly of brain-dead teenagers, and the ephemeral nature of Reddit’s posting lends itself poorly to collaborative research.

As I’ve stated in my progress log, once I reach 7.5 NBP I will focus on AM for a bit to target girth. I am starting AM1 again next week (along with week 2 of my 1st FIRE cycle) which should help prep me for the more advanced exercises that actually put on size (SABRE/BFR/AM3) and I should be done with my cut at that point so I can bulk and eat at a calorie surplus. Basically, I will be in a perfect position to perform an objective test on the Angion Methods for 3-6 months. I’ll start a separate log here and be happy to share any results (or lack thereof) with members here. If I make gains, I will show before and after picture proof.

Anyway, that’s my piece on this; I don’t want to derail the thread topic any further.

PS: Very cool device. Looking forward to seeing future developments with it.

Also you can only edit posts within 10 minutes of posting


Last edited by RedCommander : 06-03-2022 at .

Originally Posted by RedCommander
Not that I am aware of, but given the nature of PE, there is very little science behind any of this. Mostly trial and error with a lot of theory, but for some reason a higher standard is placed on claims from Janus even though most of this is still bro science.

However, the FIRE theory of hanging is the most revolutionary development in a long time and actually relies on studies of similar tissue as its foundation. The speed that practitioners are able to gain significant length is nothing short of astonishing, and I can’t wait to see a similar breakthrough occur in our understanding of girth gains. I am also a huge fan of the source of gains being the shaft rather than the ligaments, as I don’t think LOT is completely dead and loose ligaments aren’t very desirable IMO.

As far as AM goes, if it truly does follow bodybuilding principles then it is a very slow method of gaining. Janus’ whole purpose was to develop a safer alternative to traditional PE that could still yield results. Substantial muscle growth takes a long time, so it’s not illogical to believe that the penis would also take a long time based on a methodology that relies on the same principles, and lurking on the AM subreddits, it seems to take a while for members to lay enough foundation for growth to occur.

I’ve read through his documentation and watched his theory videos, and the logic seems sound. When practicing his method I can absolutely notice improved EQ almost right away, but I have been focused on traditional PE because AM is more focused on girth than length, and I want my 7.5 NBP measurement in a reasonable time-frame. Additionally, the quality of this forum is light-years beyond Reddit, which consists mostly of brain-dead teenagers, and the ephemeral nature of Reddit’s posting lends itself poorly to collaborative research.

As I’ve stated in my progress log, once I reach 7.5 NBP I will focus on AM for a bit to target girth. I am starting AM1 again next week (along with week 2 of my 1st FIRE cycle) which should help prep me for the more advanced exercises that actually put on size (SABRE/BFR/AM3) and I should be done with my cut at that point so I can bulk and eat at a calorie surplus. Basically, I will be in a perfect position to perform an objective test on the Angion Methods for 3-6 months. I’ll start a separate log here and be happy to share any results (or lack thereof) with members here. If I make gains, I will show before and after picture proof.

Anyway, that’s my piece on this; I don’t want to derail the thread topic any further.

PS: Very cool device. Looking forward to seeing future developments with it.

Also you can only edit posts within 10 minutes of posting

Thanks for your detailed response.

Re: Girth

Check this out: MOTHER OF ALL GIRTH ROUTINES : AJelqForYou

I may eventually do something like that, though with a quicker way to release in case of an emergency. That seems to be the best way to target girth by applying force outward. If we can find a way to pair that with US heat, we might be on to a girth revolution. Even without, it seems like the guy got some pretty good results in just a few sessions. The other thing is that it would probably have to be done erect, as applying US heat while not elongated may cause collagen retraction and as such, a loss of length gains (which has happened to Kyrpa before).

Top

All times are GMT. The time now is 12:28 PM.