Knowing whether you are limited by Dorsal Thickening/Septum

Did you mean to say “When elevated viscosity* kicks in”? Or elasticity? As below 32 it is more elastic, above 32 it is less and more viscous.

Sorry for the double post. From the study, would you know if the 5% strain is arbitrary or what is it related to? 5% of what?

But I see what you mean. I was having a hard time wrapping my head around it.

So for the 42°, which is of most interest, a 5% strain, results in a peak of 0.5 MPas at the ~5 second mark, decreasing and plateauing at ~0.3 MPas at the 2min mark, and remaining at that stress until 30min, and indefinitely I presume.

0.5 MPas = ~72.5PSI and 0.3 MPas = ~43.5psi, or a 40% decrease in required PSI, due to a 42°T, for the same level of strain.

I think given these findings, one could then extrapolate and say that one could hang at 10lbs at 42° for 2 min and lower the weight down gradually to 6lbs to have the same level of strain on the cord. Of more use though, keeping the weight constant at 10lbs would mean strain increases as T goes by, perhaps by 40%? Could one then say that once the “cord” is at 42° throughout, only 2 mins is necessary to achieve maximum achievable strain?

If so, a protocol emphasizing 1) cord being warmed up to 42° first, then 2) stressing cord by x PSI via fulcrum for at least 2 min, 4-5min probably optimally and 3) retaining load until temperature is back to normal, for viscosity to go back down, and become more elastic at the new length. Would be optimal. Given that after the 2min mark there is a plateau, it would be more efficient to cool down, work another area, and repeat maybe 1-2 times a day, or perhaps more, as evidenced my Monochromes high success and high rate of growth in length gains using the sock as a fulcrum everywhere he went. Frequency trumping duration, and heat being the catalyst for gains.

Given a cord with a circumference 0.5in and length of 6in(from PB to crown of head), the area of the cord is then 3in^2. Taking 72.5*3 = 217.5 lbs.. and 43.5*3= 130 lbs, which would imply the whole cord being worked at once. Since we are using fulcrums, I think only a small portion of the cord is being worked the most, and it goes without saying 200lbs of force on your dick is not something I’d recommend. But, say that of 100% of the cord, one targets 5% of the area of the whole, then ~11lbs (217.5*0.05) would be required to have the same results in the study, assuming tunica and the human supraspinatus tendon resemble the same structure.

One could establish a regimen of fulcrum hanging by using a specific weight (or simply sock fulcrum stretching, since it is more practical given frequency seems to be the name of the game) given the area of their cord, and dividing the cord to be practical into 3 parts. Each time target heat area to 42° and then fulcrum hang for 2-3min, then cool down. Repeat for each area being worked, twice a day at least.

I hope I am not reading too much into this study.

Sorry for being confusing earlier:)
But in my mind I was already at the 42° region. What you describe above is pretty much the way I am hitting the cord with stretching.
I happen to have this dorsal/ septum cord. I have hit the wall at 18cm both BPEL and BPFSL at me previous attempts twice in my earlier PE history and always stopped PE for this reason completely.

At this attempt I started again after 10 years of hiatus using Ultrasound to heat the cord for stretching. Starting at 18cm BPFSL and now after 15 weeks I measured 20.3cm today.
I am using stretching similar style you described. I use PM Pro 60min to get the natural elastic limit setting tension up in few minute steps until I reach maximum length. Then I will start to heat up firstly ten minutes from upside and same for downside. When using US there is hot rice sock on opposite side. Same time I can put more tension on PM as new elastic lenghtening is awailable. At the limit of heated elasticity I wrap hot rice sock (500g) upside the unit an let it hang downwards for few minutes.
After that starts US heated manual stretches or fulcrum or vacuum stretching sets of 2 mins each which are supposed to hit beyond the elastic limits with as minimal force as possible.
Last part is wearing PMP with rods at maximal lenght as the unit cools down.

It is working greatly at the moment.

I am very much inspired by Marineras thoughts on stretching discussed here:

Loading, lengthening, healing.

Can you please link your ultrasound unit, would be much appreciated since im reading up on using that kind of protocol for peyronie placque.

Here is for Henrik

I am using US Pro 2000 2nd Edition

To effectively heat one must use max power (H) 1.60 W/cm2 and to keep it warm enough still need some kind of heating pad, rice sock etc.
Cooling effect of penile blood circulation is just too much for staying warm enough with US alone. I am also using infrared thermometer to estimate heating level.

This is great confirmation that it works. Thank you for the link.

I have the same septum limiting factor and also stuck at surprisingly 18cm

About the 60min, is it because of this:

Front the rat tail study. http://www.jgp. … nt/43/2/265.pdf
……
"It appears
that two distinct regions of [stress] decay occur, both approximately linear with the
logarithm of time. The second region begins after about 60 minutes. When
stress decay has reached its apparent limiting value, it is found that an in-
crease in temperature lowers the stress, while a decrease in temperature in-
creases the stress. Both of these processes are reversible, and the variation in
stress is approximately linear with temperature as shown in Fig. 8. It is also
found in these experiments that prolonged strains (even within the reproduc-
ible region) are deleterious to the tendon if the time exceeds 60 minutes; i.e.,
the time at which the second decay region begins in the relaxation phenom-
enon."

……

Could you shed some light why you gradually stretch with no temperature increase to maximum elastic tension limit during 60min before introducing heat?

Versus why you don’t introduce heat at the start of PM use? Would you not reach the same maximum heated elasticity faster?

This minimal force in your experience, can you quantify it, or does it change for every workout?
If it is quantifiable and measurable, have you found that the minimal force needs to increase over time, in order to hit beyond the elastic limits, assuming the protocol is constant?
Besides that, what weight do you usually use for fulcrum stretches?
How many sets, what areas, and which angles do you use?
Do you cool down between sets?
For final cooling, how long do you cool down on PM for?
For this protocol, how many times a day/week do you do? Do you have rest days?
Besides the main protocol you use, do you also manual stretch throughout the day to mantain elongation? Sort of like Monochrome did with the sock fulcrum stretches.

Great questions manko007, I’ll be following the answer with great interests.

Thanks for sharing Kyrpa.

Here’s a bit of a downer about ultrasounds though;

https://www.pai nscience.com/ar … /ultrasound.php

Great link. There is somewhere a similar study made with cadaver tendons indicating same kind of results. I prefer to start easy because tend to feel the level of strain better without heat. Gradually increasing tension adjusting PM from 0,6kg to 1,1 kg at 30min point. I can see elongation as tissues relax even more after this and more adjustment is needed in PM rods to max out. Though it might be slippage on vacuum head also.
This is my own thinking to firstly max out natural abilities before introduce heat aided extra properties in elastic length. Gradual stretching as one doesn´t want to accidentally jump to hardcore department of plastic region too early. Considering this is the only heavy duty practice in five days circulation I reckon it has to be executed thoroughly.
If I can get everything out as long as been on elastic stretch with 1,1 kg + 0,5 kg rice sock while stretching downwards I consider minimal force to go beyond to be anything above that.
Actual force application for vacuum stretches which I personally use are resistance bands used in yoga and fitness training. I am sticking with lightest (yellow) for which I have measured progressive load to be from 3kg to 8 kg. I prefer to stay somewhere 3 to 5 kg area.

BPFSL is measurable indicator if top area of elastic range or lets say plastic region is reached. For an example one of the latest workouts produced 5mm elongation which was 2,5% of the cold BPFSL measured just before workout.

Workouts go on as IPR(ish) cycles. Repeating these five day cycles for five rounds follow 5 to n. Days long mini decon.
Following micro cycle contains more work not force as long as gains are coming at same rate or better.
If gains start to slow down then following micro cycle backs of in workload and more force is introduced and so on.
Three months in there is few weeks wearing a light ADS followed with a longer decon break.
It is left to be seen if it is going to work in long term. At this point I can only say that after a few cycles gains are coming.

For fulcrums this same rubber band is used. I would say with same load or maybe little more but clearly not more than 5kgs.
Vacuum stretches 4x30sec between compass points. Preferring northwest and northeast to produce best feelings of stress in the tissues.
Repeated for maximum of 20mins. Fulcrums and longitudinal stretches are alternating in different cycles.
Manual stretches are considered heaviest of stretches and are introduced at micro cycles 4 and five. Stretching in every compass points.
No cool down between sets.
Final cooling is 30 mins with PM at maximal length. It is felt as strain increases as unit cools down.

Three days of work. Day on 15min jelqing and PM stretching without and with the heat for 2 hours. Second day for heaviest of stretches as explained. Third day is 6 hours with ADS for elongation(P) after heavy duty stretching day. Days four and five are for rest (R)

Completely ignored :) You know pharmaceutical companies like to sell their products.

Thank you for your responses. I tried your method yesterday. Gradually stretched for 60min to reach max elasticity. Then fulcrum hung while applying heat trying to get to atleast 40°. Used a 9” fulcrum at first, then hammer handle to spot fulcrum 3 different parts of the cord, base, middle, and top. At the end, I had about 2.5-3% increase of the cold BPFSL as you mention. It seems to be working. I will continue this method to see if I see gains.

I only used 5 kg, and saw deformation, whereas before I’d use 8kg with no heat and saw no change. I can also feel the fatigue right on the cord.

One question though, you mentioned:

“If gains start to slow down then following micro cycle backs of in workload and more force is introduced and so on.”

If my cold BPFSL goes back to normal, does this mean gains are slowing? And I should increase force? Or should I keep same force for some cycles to “cement” the 2.5-3% increase into cold BPFSL, before increasing the force?

We are after all looking for erectic gains so keep your measures taken quite often. Heated BPFSL is used as a tool for workout effectivity. Cementing cold BPSFL is surely needed to gain more BPEL. Jumps on heated BPSFL are followed as increase in BPSFL and then comes much needed erectic gains we are looking for.
I think this is very important with steel cord cases. More force when increasing sets or time are not bringing EL gains.

Would you tell what you mean by hammerhead and describe your fulcrum routine more detailed.

Great monitoring method for gains. I can definitely understand what you mean.

Hammer handle is just the handle of a hammer, it’s about 1.5" diameter and I use it as a fulcrum. Just any hammer. I also use a wine bottle as a fulcrum which has a circumference of 9". Marinera said a fulcrum should measure your BPEL for downward hang, and BPEL + 2" if you hang upside northwest northeast angles. But I also use the 1.5" for spot fulcrum strains. I hang northeast.

For my routine, I stretch gradually for 60 min as per your routine and based on the study. No heat yet.
For this I use a phallosan forte (PF) and I gradually shorten the elastic strip until max shortening at 60min. Maybe max elastic strength of this is 2-3kg. I am not sure. I shorten every 15 min. I am targeting the cord on my left ventral side, which I feel is the strongest and most limiting, thus on the PF I wear it so my penis is stretching to the right against my hip bone. The plastic foam ring the PF has also acts as a fulcrum for this if you are familiar.

Once 60min passed, I hang the weight of 5kg to my PF and lay on floor, with penis stretched to the right ( to target left ventral cord). I can manage this because I have a pulley (https://www.ama … /dp/B006U4MBC0/ ) placed on a high chair and the weight behind the pulley, so I can hang upside.
I use this IR lamp : https://www.ama … /dp/B00IVPMZKE/

I place wine bottle of 9" on right side of penis, and fulcrum so the outer part of the left ventral cord is stretched over it, which will receive the most strain. Then I heat with the lamp about 3-4" distance until I feel I am about to burn my skin. When I feel about to burn my skin I put lamp farther and adjust I do this for 10min aprox. Then I turn off lamp and stay in that position for 10min cool down. Based on the study it takes less than 10min for rat tail to go back to normal. Except because of heat this normal already feels longer than before.

Then I hang again same angle everything but I use the hammer handle to spot fulcrum. I start same process. I start with spot fulcrum nearest base. Then middle. Then right below head. Each for 5min. No cool downs. 5 min each so 15min hang. I keep heat on all time. Then when finished 15min I switch back to wine bottle fulcrum and cool down for 10min.

Then I am done and wear PF for 60min.

As a post workout, I am manual stretching with my finger as a fulcrum later in the day. And also each time I go to bathroom. To maintain the new elastic range.

Thanks for insight view. Looks like a solid program to me. Looking closely on your progress.
Now I intend to start using hammer as well. Should bring the needed leverage using fulcrum as a pivot. Plan is to attach vacuum chamber to the claw of the hammer with a plastic band for better management of the produced force.

Thats very interesting. I plan to do something similar in the future but for now i dont have the privacy and the time.

Congrats for your well structured routine. I have a great belief that it can lead to big gains in the long term with the less "toughening" possible.

I have nothing to add because you know exactly what you are doing. Please keep us updated in your progress thread. I will be a follower.