Buckfever's progress report/bananaman story.

10/30/2018

100%++ max tension @ 60 minutes

++ Got to max tension @ ~ 10 minutes.

Followed the same accelerated rate of tension increase and this time was able to get the full 60 minute session in. Rode the fatigue the last 4 minutes or so. At this point all there is to do is put in the time.

Reflecting on the log I did try a day where I got 3X60 minute sessions and the log revealed that it took a considerable amount of time to get back to the same tension/duration in the subsequent days. I don’t know that there wasn’t a long term benefit, but I’m inclined to go by the log and suspect that was too much for the tissues. Right now I’m inclined to keep the max on a day to 2X60 minute sessions. During the last round I did many days of those with single day sessions interspersed and that seemed to go well.

Gentlepsychopath made a comment about how to break through a plateau he was shooting for 5 hours a week under tension. It kind of made me realize that this is probably a useful metric to measure. The thing is that it’s actually difficult to measure, with the extender. Because in the second session of the day the glans always sits further forward in the cradle so it takes less backing out of the screws to arrive at the same tension. But even so it is the time after we get to the max tension of the session that really is the relevant time.

If it take 30 minutes to get to max tension on a session lasting an hour, this is much less work than a session where max tension is achieved in 10 minutes and held for an hour. But as Gentlepsychopath did, I think some qualitative parameters can be surmised.

At the end of the day small incremental improvements of tension, duration and forward position in the extender serve as sufficient guideposts as indicators of progress. And the log provides loose guidelines of what is too little and too much.

10/31/2018

100%++ max tension @ 56 minutes

Didn’t get the attachment exactly right which created discomfort, so had to cut it short a few minutes.

10/31/2018

Second session

68%++ max tension @ 48 minutes

Got to max session tension at ~ 7.5 minutes. New high water mark on tension for a second session.

Just a little too much tension to get to 60 minutes, but that went well.

11/1/2018
100%++ max tension @ 60+minutes

Forgot to set the chrono initially so the session was over the 60 minutes. Last 4 minutes the fatigue was intense. Glans is almost back to the forward position in the cradle so progress is ongoing. I am quite sure that the short term goal will be realized and that we have not hit a wall of diminishing returns as yet.

Next 2 weeks I’ll be travelling but it is local so I’ll have my extender with me and should have an hour in the evenings. I view the next 2-3 weeks as maintenance.

Not to get ahead of myself but I have been thinking past the short term goal.

I have read a lot about collagen remodeling and 240 days seems to be a widely held clinical position. So when I was initially setting up the long term goal I fully intended to carry on 240 past that point to cement and then get on a maintenance program focusing on EQ and health.

But as is often the case, when diving in to this endeavor, contemplating magnificence regarding the male form I think is a natural thought at least it has been for me. What started out as restoration, has shifted towards realizing potential. And since I’m already committed to carrying on 240 day past the initial goal, why not carry on and view it as an investment in exploring potential.

I think for what ever reason there is a two fold curiosity. One is when exactly in the process will I hit a wall? Secondly is this idea related to magnificence and somewhere formed this idea that adding another full inch to the extender length beyond the initial goal, would be extraordinary. And lately my thoughts have been drifting towards the extraordinary.

And while I am so inclined I also expect that will be it. Which is not to be presumptive because because such an accomplishment is far from certain and of course things are subject to revision.

But there have been some minor in use feedback issues which would put a hard limit for me to consider anything past that. Others will make that exploration.

There is another theory that I have and that is that there is a hard limit to what an individual can gain. I suspect that there is a genetic range to “healthy” penis size that an individual can have and that there are development influences that affect the expression of that size and that PE essentially provides the opportunity to reverse the developmental limits and to realize one’s potential. I know that this is contrary to the widely held view here and I could be wrong, but evidence does not support it.

Anyway that’s my bias and it is shaping the formation of my long term goals. The process has shifted for me from restoration towards realizing potential, to explore where that potential lies as represented by the point of diminishing returns and setting a goal of the addition of another inch to the extender length as a lofty goal that will inspire.

You have to remember your biases are based on your age and recollection of having the size you had in your prime. Thusly, shifting that view to a facet of the same mindset that there is a hidden optimal maximum size is completely based on your views of your past size from before and your recently past size of prior to your PE campaign.

The killing part is there is a good chance that you may have been smaller in your prime than where you are now and there is no way to be truly sure because most confident in their size only measure late into PE, seldom before at any point. Here, cognitive bias can blur gains, restoration and potential when truly only one thing exists. That, which you sought, created and gained.

Additionally collagen remodeling is a function of the body that is nigh continuous considering the body’s needs. And potential, particularly with traction, has only the hard limit of time and effort. That a continuous gains rate based on creeping tissue growth is very possible, should it be a desire you have the temperance to seek.

Or, as I like to say, I have never seen anyone who has experienced significant gains quit because there was no other way forward. Limitations based on lifestyle and partner but never “end of the road” limits that simply appeared and were left in the way of an ultimate goal, undemolished.

That simply has not happened to anyone I have know who has gained significantly. Boredom and an overall fatigue of the process but never a wall, for such a thing pales compared to what we are capable of.

I think that thoughtfulgold’s response is a perfect example of the power of constructive, collaberative alliances. Think of the timeliness and precision of the response, for absent those alliances it could not be so.

And I appreciate it.

Now keep in mind that when I say theory, it is just that a theory, a conjecture, it does not make it right. So where does my theory come from that there is a genetic limit to gains? Especially in light of seemingly non conforming information to that theory, where there are those who have not experienced a point of diminishing marginal returns?

Because we have those examples of those who have not stopped seeing gains, I can argue that those are few, but they are there. Moreover they are legitimate examples where the penile function is maintained, so they are not situations outside my premise, of non functional gains.

So my only real answer to this is that those few individuals are still functioning within their genetic potential and have yet to hit a wall.

Another challenge to my theory are those individuals who did hit a wall and after an extensive amount of time of trying for additional gains, finally called it. But then years later return and find that additional gains are forth coming. So how can I explain this? This for me ties into the idea of tissue adaptation and remodeling. That if the rate of gains exceeds the rate of tissue remodeling at some point there will not be tissue available at that time for additional remodeling. So my idea here does not align exactly with deconditioning but rather that the tissues need time to remodel. But for me this still lies within the genetic limits.

And I can continue with contradictions to my theory, I am not ignorant to them, yet I still haven’t explained a damned thing about why I think there is a genetic limit.

So why do I go there?

Basically because we don’t see 10” dicks. There are very, very, very few examples and from my anecdotal reasoning, the mere myth of the 10” dick would be sufficient to drive many PE practitioners there.
I appreciate that there are many such as myself who would not go there even if they could for self imposed in use limits, but as far as the distribution of goals, I have no doubt there would be ample vigorous interest to achieve such a goal and we just don’t see it.

Having said all that I would love for my theory to be false. That there is only a mechanism of action and that if one stays within the parameters for gains, gains are ongoing as long as there is remodeled tissue. And I am looking for that evidence and there are those who are trying to prove it. I just haven’t seen it yet.

One can also argue what use is all this if for most the limit exceeds the goal?

But I think for myself that is in fact where I have arrived. We come on to this endeavor by whatever motivation with disbelief and then when well past it we ponder, “is there a limit”?

I suspect that there is but whether there is one or isn’t, it is tempered by that which I am willing to pursue.

And I do not wish to ignore the unbounded mindset. For myself I can compartmentalize, I do not find these positions mutually exclusive.

11/2/2018

100%++ max tension @ 60 minutes

got to max tension @ 10 minutes.

The glans is now pretty much sitting in the same previous forward position in the cradle, however there was an appreciable increase in the amount of fatigue at the end of the session, that was pretty tough to ride out.

For sure we need to get to the point of accommodation so that there is less tension at the end of the session. I also think we’re going to try to get even further forward in the cradle during this round to give us a little more room to play with as we step into the next phase of this endeavor.

The last extender increase took 88 days, we’re only 14 days in on this one, for whatever reason, trial and error, I do feel I’ve stumbled onto a sweet spot and I’m inclined not to change a thing.

And additional inch of extender length if there are no diminishing returns and no interruptions would take at a minimum 2 years and more likely 2 and a half years. In addition there would need to be another 8 months to cement the gains so this would would be a ~ 3 year commitment.

It would be foolish to be overzealous.

This supposition disregards the months or years of stalling, silence and vanishing practitioners of greater than 5 years tenure tend to have happen. I speak for myself and at least xeno here that silence and not notaring progress may be one and the same. Progress is logarithmic by nature, be it muscle or penis growth. It slows, simply because creep is the slowest possible rate and a gains rate of 2 cubic inches per year with a certain amount of length and girth is barely measurable after a certain size. This, is a gains rate that Bearded Dragon mapped using hundreds of users in the database who minded their gains.

*At 2 cubic inches per year and my own gain of 4.33 in just over 2 years my average is the same as anyone else but more marginal in appearance proportionally.

You are using adaptation and remodeling as the same concepts. They are simultaneous but not the same. Adaptation requires deconditioning. Remodeling requires time that is not necessarily idle.

Here you confuse genetic limits per the DNA of a particular person with the biological limits of a human body as a general organism.

You overestimate the temperance required to reach more than triple your starting size. For most, an average gain of 1” length and .5” girth over up to 3 years is respectable and retirement worthy. Most who crack the code simply disappear into the ether. I fight that urge daily.

The existence of a goal that demands more than 5 years and reduces sex partner pools is not reason enough for most men to attain it. It doesn’t bear out and those motivated enough are too driven by desperation to crack the code.

Logarithmic gains are depressing. Over 2 years have passed and after cresting 8.75” length and 5.9” girth as of me starting here and me now at 9.25x6.25” is a very small gain compared to the starting gain rates of length and girth and even your rate of extender growth and additions, when extenders by design are the slowest method there is.

**But, those two sets of measurements are a 4.33 cubic inch difference. The time span of 2 years and 4 months nearly exactly says 4.33 cubic inches as a predicted gain on the high end of 1-2 cubic inches per year.

We don’t see it because months of working for so little aren’t logs worth updating. And anyone at this point usually is done with the community because it offers them no more that they do not already know. Veterans who crack the code all vanish unless they specifically hang back to give back and inspire and stop talking about the size they’ve created.

2 cubic inches when you’re at nearly 30 is a pittance and depressing proportionally. As an annual reward is difficult to even quantify as more than measuring error even.

What would be the parameters of such an extraordinary bar for evidence of a phenomenon of this type?

This is why a great deal of those who crack the code stop. Temperance takes them to a goal and meters the greed for more. Mentality is a limit some choose for their own good.

Yet, you function safely within your purported position. The unbounded mindset serves neither desire nor function on your particular path as outlined. So while you may find the positions diametrically opposed but somehow amenable to each other there is no need for you to straddle, for your journey is defined by one not the other.

I come to contest it in principle, as the entire theory strikes me as incomplete. To feel as you like is your right but I present my own anecdotes, having seen much in my own journey. Ultimately I am barely bound by my own mental limits much less anyone else’s. But I like to share to expand as many horizons as I can, even at a fundamental difference of viewpoint.

I really appreciate the response.

“You are using adaptation and remodeling as the same concepts.”

I think that it important that you point this out. I’m saying that adaptation can not occur on said tissues until remodeling occurs, barring injury.

“Adaptation requires deconditioning.”

By this do you mean that further adaptation requires deconditioning? I guess my question is, exactly what is deconditioning, clinically? Because I don’t know.

“You overestimate the temperance required to reach more than triple your starting size.”

You’re saying that people just can’t do it? You’re very likely right

“What would be the parameters of such an extraordinary bar for evidence of a phenomenon of this type?”

Well given the aforementioned, probably how long you’ll continue.

“Progress is logarithmic by nature, be it muscle or penis growth.”

So there are tissues where this is not the case as in distraction osteogenesis, within the parameters of remodeling and physical limits, it’s purely linear. Which is not a contradiction to your premise although I would point out that the argument that gains are logarithmic, does not undercut the idea of a hard limit. And it may be that the 2 concepts at the margin are not dissimilar. I’ll argue that here is a hard stop, you’ll argue that the gains rate while approaching zero have no terminus. At that point we should just discuss Calculus.

“The unbounded mindset serves neither desire nor function on your particular path as outlined.”

Yes for me, but I would argue that for that the unbounded, it’s not mutually exclusive.

Adaption is a form of remodeling, the same sort that keeps you from re-injuring a joint or developing a blister to prevent friction wear on your skin.

Deconditioning is the time for your body to move out of defensive adaptations like blistering, as my previous example, for you to move forward with traumas that cause structural remodeling. Scar tissues and other weird toughening can occur that lessen in effectiveness with time. You see this in guys who do so much PE that they lose EQ for weeks and months, because they have traumatized the PC muscle or other structures and until the body stops defending from the PE stimulus no further remodeling that we desire, especially in any permanent capacity (as these guys report loss of all gains during these instances) can be performed.

My nine years is a drop in the bucket to some guys who have seen half the gains I have in 13 years. They are tempered but even that guarantees nothing, it just gives you the chance.

I have set a 40 cubic inch mark for the finish. At 28 and change now, I’ll get back to you at 34 ci and report in.

This is where it gets muddy. Gains rates of newbies of all ages are usually greater than the default 2 cubic inches per year. Except when it isn’t. Assuming that it is, which in 80% of cases is true, you have a point of diminishing returns comparatively in the first 2 years. At least on its face.

Why ‘its face’? Because we do it based on raw length and girth gains. Once your penis becomes larger, smaller increases still count for big cubic inch increases by volume. My first year, going from 6.25x4.37” to 7.5x5” is around 5.5 ci (I think I got bigger in this period but the exact size I was at a year versus 18 months is splitting hairs in this context) and me continuing to increase drastically in length and girth isn’t realistic at this rate. But, movement from 7.5x5” to 7.75x5.5” is another 3.6 cubic inches of growth in roughly a year’s time. But it isn’t nearly as noticeable as the first growth spurt and is still far above the 2 cubic inch per year (remember it is 1-2 cubic inches per year for an average) bottoming out point.

Then, take my current size. If I make a tenth of an inch in both length and girth that is 1.22 cubic inches. Me at 9.35x6.35” is a 1.22 cubic inch gain! which I know I’ll easily do in a year and then some! (this is another topic)

Even though that amount of gain is easily confused with measurement error! I say that gains are logarithmic because they become harder to detect and the continuation of creating raw space taking up mass (VOLUME is the word) is incredibly slow when the scale of the penis in question breaches a certain point. After 8.5x6” the gains become something different because the scale of increase is entirely different than when it started. It has to be!

That said, after a certain size the default gains rate must rise again because there is so much tissue remodeling at once that the scale alone will consume what the average gains rate for those hundreds of guys were because so few were of such a scale that the geometry applied and averaged out statistically will cease to apply. The gains are still very hard to detect but even those, the closer I creep to 10x7” will be statistically greater than 2ci per year if I continue the way I have been.

As a member of the unbounded, I respectfully disagree. No dream, goal or desire is defined by limitations. Only what it is that the person seeks and what they will do to get it.

11/2/2018

Second session

68% max tension @ 58 minutes

So close and yet so far.

“This is where it gets muddy. Gains rates of newbies of all ages are usually greater than the default 2 cubic inches per year. Except when it isn’t. Assuming that it is, which in 80% of cases is true, you have a point of diminishing returns comparatively in the first 2 years. At least on its face.

Why ‘its face’? Because we do it based on raw length and girth gains. Once your penis becomes larger, smaller increases still count for big cubic inch increases by volume. My first year, going from 6.25x4.37” to 7.5x5” is around 5.5 ci (I think I got bigger in this period but the exact size I was at a year versus 18 months is splitting hairs in this context) and me continuing to increase drastically in length and girth isn’t realistic at this rate. But, movement from 7.5x5” to 7.75x5.5” is another 3.6 cubic inches of growth in roughly a year’s time. But it isn’t nearly as noticeable as the first growth spurt and is still far above the 2 cubic inch per year (remember it is 1-2 cubic inches per year for an average) bottoming out point.

Then, take my current size. If I make a tenth of an inch in both length and girth that is 1.22 cubic inches. Me at 9.35x6.35” is a 1.22 cubic inch gain! which I know I’ll easily do in a year and then some! (this is another topic)

Even though that amount of gain is easily confused with measurement error! I say that gains are logarithmic because they become harder to detect and the continuation of creating raw space taking up mass (VOLUME is the word) is incredibly slow when the scale of the penis in question breaches a certain point. After 8.5x6” the gains become something different because the scale of increase is entirely different than when it started. It has to be!

That said, after a certain size the default gains rate must rise again because there is so much tissue remodeling at once that the scale alone will consume what the average gains rate for those hundreds of guys were because so few were of such a scale that the geometry applied and averaged out statistically will cease to apply. The gains are still very hard to detect but even those, the closer I creep to 10x7” will be statistically greater than 2ci per year if I continue the way I have been.”

It may be muddy but this provided greater clarity regarding your perspective. And also as it gives me a thought that I may be in fact be running an experiment that may disprove my own theory.

It’s math, plain and simple. You started with a greater size than many. But…that simply is your start point.

The calculus for what progress is, in essence, doesn’t change from guy to guy. Generation of volume, of more cock to insert, is it. The scale changes but the patterns and means much less so. Cubic Inches are the key to the stories we tell.

11/3/2018

5 short sessions of various tension for a whopping total of 56 minutes. I would have to say that travelling and extending might not be the most optimal LOL. I think doing something is better than nothing, although I will admit I’m not sure.