Is LESS more, or is MORE more?

Equine Rooster-

Due to the fact that I seldom ejaculate, I have noticed that when I pull out during sex, my dick is often bigger and fatter than I can ever get it by jerking or even edging. What is even stranger is that it is under pressure form the vaginal walls. So you would think that would make it smaller. Women! I am addicted. Thank God I’ve got a good wife.

Pheromones won’t enhance recovery, but a testosterone boost would…I think it boosts testosterone. However, the pheromones, plus visual and all the rest might be the trigger for the testosterone boost.

Just wondering, with regards to EQ, if a proper routine and length is applied, then one can achieve 100% erection on demand (through visual/mental stimulation)?

Right now, I can only achieve about 80% erection through visual/mental stimulation or from morning wood. (Through physical contact, i think i am achieving 100%. Whether it is 100% or not, one thing is for sure. It is very hard.)

Also, I do have a problem staying erect for over 3 minutes during jelq sessions.

Does that mean My EQ could be improved, and that i should adjust my routine?

With proper PE, one can greatly ENHANCE your EQ, which means improve WHAT YOU HAVE. How far you can go is an individual thing. Subjectively improve, objective range is an indiviual thing. Like bodybuilding, you can get bigger and stronger than you were, will you look like the Pros? Depends on genetics, training, nutrition, drugs, etc.

Some guys might end up with EQ so high, its like they’re 14 again…for some it might be a tremendous improvement from an impotent state to where they can have sex again. You total potential depends on many factors, and I certainly can’t predict where you personally will end up. I can safely say it should be significantly better than where you start out. BUT, thats if you PE PROPERLY!!! If you greatly OVER DO IT, your EQ WILL drop significantly. Its one of the sure indicators of over doing your ability to recover from the stress you induced into your tissues.

Whether your EQ can improve more, is only something you can answer. To answer it, try doing more for a few sessions and see what happens. If your EQ drops, obviously its too much. I would then try doing less than your normal routine for a week…and see what happens. If your EQ raises, you probably were doing a bit too much.

You guys have to be precise in your PE and keep track of it. Your training logs should be able to answer most of these questions if you keep one, and track the results of various times, intensities and methods.

Its like all serious lifters keep a log. There is really no way to reach high levels of strength or size without one. For most of us in PE, a log is very, very helpful.

Less is definitely better for me, recently I have been hitting a little over 6.8” bp(!) and all I have been doing is 3 - 5 minutes jelqing while in the shower. I’m thinking if I just continue to do that (as well as kegelling) I can get good EQ and keep it for a long long time! Gains will hopefully come as well, I am doing a psychology course and I am trying to put a lot of mental focus on my goals rather than spending hours bent over my dick probably causing it some damage.

If my length continues to increase then I am going to have the worst pencil dick :S

If I continue in the directions I have been going in until I reach my length goal of 8” BP and still have around 4.3” girth I will get severe penis depression :P

Sorry if I am rambling I haven’t slept in 37 hours.

Very useful thread, always reminding me from doing the routine too hard.

It’s like today, I got contraction after session again.

But my routine is already real light

semi erect bend 4 directions x 2 mins

warm up 5 mins

jelqing 120 strokes which take me 12mins

warm down 5 mins

That’s enough for me to get contraction. :S

Contraction isn’t necessarily bad. It depends how long it lasts and what is happening to your EQ and gains. If you contract for a couple hours, but its followed by SRR (super relaxation response) which is a large and heavy flaccid due to smooth muscle RELAXATION then its not a problem. Especially is nite wood and overall EQ is good, then I wouldn’t worry about contraction.

If you have very sensitive smooth muscle, its damn near impossible to pass the breakover point and NOT get contraction, but as long as overall EQ is high and gains are coming, its not a problem. If however, your contraction lasts all day and into the nite, certainly if it persists into the next morning, I would consider backing off a bit.

If you think your contraction is a bad indicator, that is, your EQ is also dropping, I would consider just easing up on the force a bit, but keep the time the same. See how that goes for you.

I’ve tried more is more and it didn’t work as well as I was hoping. I literally used to hang all day every day (one day off a week) competing with myself to get the most sets into each day, to get to what I thought wasthe sweet-spot for gains reported by the heavy hangers.

Part of the thinking behind my routine was to actually consciously condition my unit to take heavier and heavier weight so that I could get into the envelope where, reputedly, gains would accelerate.

I broke my hanger trying to hang just a fraction of the weight claimed by the old-school heavy-hangers. I even had to resort to using a carpenter’s d-clamp to attach the hanger just to be able to hang about half of the weight that was suggested for optimum gain.

Even when I plateaued I still persisted in hanging, way past the point of diminished returns, basically because I wanted to get it over and done with once and for all, so that I could get on with my life. After about three months of no further gains I just came to consider those three months a maintenance/’cementing’ routine and gave up entirely. When I started I only saw the idea of less is more posted by one guy who virtually nobody paid any attention to. He said he was getting consistent gains with what seemed like barely any exercise and, at the time, it sounded ludicrous.

Having taken a long long time off I’m back for the last half-inch and I’m starting with the ‘new newbie / Linear’ routine (NEW newbie + advanced routine) at the lowest intensity it describes (I’ve just done a few heavy-duty, multiple method days but having read about this new approach I’m cutting right back to a starting point of twenty jelqs every other day), basically because I want to spend as little time and effort as possible in getting the last half-inch, and I want to know more accurately my best potential for future gains in case I want to get even larger, and by spending this little time at the beginning of my return to P.E. it should, in the long run, save me a lot of time that would otherwise be spent on over-training and decon breaks. A lot of the problem with non-gainers could very well be lack of patience (and lack of discipline). I used to way too impatient and, because I really believed that gains had to be hard won, I think I probably pushed myself much too hard. Now that I’m able to jelq, and, having seriously committed myself to a newbie routine for the first time I can see just how much of it was to do with my attitude towards the process.

When I first began P.E. I was unwell, and not strong enough do manual exercises, so I went straight to Penimaster and then to a hanger and then on to (what now seems to be) a ridiculously intensive hanging regime, basically because it seemed like minimum effort for maximum gains— after all I only had to attach the equipment every half hour and then I was hands-free to get on with what I needed to do. It seems sensible enough but I went on increasing the intensity and duration of my routine until I was hanging literally all day, and having never jelqed I had no idea that what I was doing was many many times more than the amount of effort I would have needed to expend on just a basic newbie routine (in my defence I wasn’t capable of a newbie routine at that time). Now that I’ve been working out at the gym and have recovered and further enhanced my strength and stamina, I’m learning to jelq properly and I’m getting all of the PI’s associated with continued gains. In fact I’m measuring an eighth of an inch over my previous bp 7.5 after only the few days of intensive PE I’d resumed before I discovered both this thread and the ‘New newbie’ linear approach NEW newbie + advanced routine

I have to admit, I made some pretty good gains through hanging and traction. I’m (‘officially’) a bone-pressed 7.5 from probably bp5.5 (I don’t have an official measurement or a pic, but trust me, if there was any way in good conscience that I could have got it to look longer against my ruler than six inches, believe me, I would have been claiming ‘over six inches’. So if we consider a ‘layman’s six’ to be a bp5.5 (the actual scientifically reported average (iirc)) that means I’ve made a two inch length gain with 98%+ hanging and Penimaster (1% newbie type exercises, clamping, pumping and some power jelq)

Here’s my own contribution to the new ‘revisionist’ approach…
Hanging Guidelines / Personal & Average Maximum Gain-rate (PMGR & AMGR)

One of the reasons I left Thunders was because I began to believe that I’d maximised the possibilities for growth, both due to the plateau after what I thought was premium effort and because a survey taken here showed that the curve dropped sharply and steeply at two inches in gains, so I basically thought I’d got as much growth as I was able to get, but I’m PEing again and all the PI are pointing towards me being able to make even further gains.

Good post Mr F.

It sounds like you have taken a long enough break to have deconditioned enough to make some fresh gains. Just remember, the heavier the wts or force, the greater the toughening, the longer the time needed to effectively decon. The beauty of using “just enough” force and time to gain, is that decon needed to “reset” and begin gaining again is far shorter.

Some of the greatest gains came from routines of modest forces, and frequent small decons. Equine Rooster has been making some of his best gains to date from just this approach. This at a time when his gains should have slowed or stopped by now.

I wish you the best with the new gains, and please keep us posted to your results. Consider a 6 weeks on and 1-2 weeks of cycle…I think you might find it very effective.

Thanks, I will do.

Do you know if more weeks on mean more weeks needed off? Is there a guideline for on to off ratios?

I don’t think more time on means more time off needed, I think more FORCE combined with more time is the critical factor. I think if you never use more than moderate force, the main drawback of prolonged active cycle is that you plateau and are wasting time. I wrote my thoughts on this a couple years ago and its linked at the bottom of my posts. Its called, “Force Thresholds”.

I find I can go a lot longer than 6 weeks, but returns seem to really drop off. I think you can up the time for the sessions and coax some more gains, but that seems to lead to greater and greater time needed to get the gains you could with much less time, if you decon. When I take the decon, I seem to set new records within the first couple weeks, and it begins to slow again. If I keep the force to a minimum, it seems a week or two is enough to reset.

PLUS, I truly believe the secret to the longest potential period of gains is keeping the force and time to a minimum, which keeps the tissue toughening to a minimum. However, this is just my opinion.

Equine Rooster is experimenting with 2 on and 2 off, or 3 on and 3 off, with a 3-4 day break every few weeks or so, and is really getting great results. This of course is combined with a routine that is modest in force, and about 15 minutes of time. It may however turn out that length gains are different than girth gains. Many guys find daily girth is more effective than taking time off…but that’s the beauty of us coming together here and brain storming. If we do it properly, we cut years off the time needed to advance our understanding of how to make this stuff work for most guys.

Tendency – I would ask what is the tendency of volume of training and lay off’s and intensity.

What I am trying to say goes something like this, it’s a U shaped curve.

Like shoe size, very few people are size 2, very few are size 12, most at the high point of the curve i.e 7 – 9.

This curve applies (just about) to every thing organic. I remember it clearly when studying levels of mental arousal / stimulation for competitive sport.

So I think it is important to ask where is this point. Even though I wouldn’t class my self as a newbie, neither would I class my self as an expert.

When I have discussed PE with others they have in effect asked what is routine that is most likely to give results. As most people whether they want to believe it or not are almost the same. In medicine, the term “most common” well its most common for a reason!

I have full belief that PE works, but at this point after what is in effect nearly a year, with what I feel is very little gains.Yeah I know that is perception, but the tape has hardly changed, and I human interpretation of change, I.e. I want it to have done so I don’t feel my effort has been wasted.

What is the sites feed back…

Johnny,

Not sure what you are asking.

Sparkyx

Sorry I did get a little carried away. I think I was trying to ask / or say…(simply put)

There must be a routine that most people get results from most of the time. There will always be pople outside to the left and right of this “norm”…

It does not make sence that such a huge varition of result producing programs, there must be an underlining program, which if most people doing PE would get most results from…

So is less more or more more.. there will always be exceptions to the rule, but these are not as common as individuals would like to think…

Phew, I hope I havent over talked that one..

If that was true, there be about 3 posts on how to do it, and all the rest saying how well they were doing!

There is a WIDE range, but basically it falls into 3 catagories, 1) more is more, 2) less is more, 3) somewhere in between.

I recommend start with jelquing at MODEST force, for 3 minutes daily…and slowly work up from there!

Add a couple minutes a week. When your EQ starts to rise, you are on the right track, when it peaks and starts to drop, you have gone a bit too far. Try to keep your EQ fairly high, and experiment in that range. Some need to drop the EQ a bit for an effective workout, but I’ve NEVER heard any one say they grow with their EQ in the toilet!

After you find about what it takes to get gains, AND what signs your bodies gives when you are in the growth zone, THEN you can begin to experiment with other methods. Then you will at least have a decent idea of what you need to do, and the reactions you show when you are close to the growth zone.

So, thats as close to a one size fits all article I know of!