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The Long Game: Learning with Longerstretch, Key Principles to Make Sustained Growth

Originally Posted by sentii
Thanks for the recommendation. I am in that intermediate stage where I am trying to use an extender for 3-4 hours a day and pump for girth 20 minutes a day. I find it interesting you suggested a high time commitment (long extender use) for this phase. I guess just because you are only doing ~1.5h/day as an advanced PEer. Did I miss somewhere why you feel traditional P.E. is best for earlier parts of career but this more time efficient new methodology is best for advanced P.E.? I would have thought maybe it would be equally advantageous to use this kind of methodology for intermediates, for example by extending with these heating and de-load/load cycles for equal or better results in less time.


I base it off my own experiences with low tension high time vacuum hanging after being stalled with manual PE for 2 years, the experiences of others and off this thread…
Loading, lengthening, healing.

This is a way to maximize gains over a lifetime, not necessarily the fastest way to gain. It keeps stress and time needed to create cascade of events leading to gains low. After some time the really low tension of traction and high time will not be enough, estimated at one year. Then you’ll need higher tension but not necessarily high time. Again the use of heat and scheduled decons helps keep the stress (weight or tension) needed for growth low. So a shorter but more intense routine is warranted. I’m currently experimenting for myself if passive ADS in addition to this shorter routine helps with the fibroblast mediated proliferation and my hypothesis is that it does.


My MaxVac Setup Longerstretch's Golf Weight and HTW setup My Log

Starting Size: circa 2003: 5 BPEL x 5.0 MSEG August 2007: 6 2/3 BPEL x 5.5 MSEG 04/22/08: 7.5 BPEL x 5.6 MSEG... On and Off again for a while... 11/25/13: 7.75 BPEL x 5.75 MSEG 08/01/19 BPEL 8.03 x 5.6 10/01/19 BPEL 8.19 x 5.6

Originally Posted by thegoat

By long decon do you mean rest from all PE or only from length exercises?Because I keep gaining girth

Rest from all PE. Again you could wean off with ADS only but if you’ve been stalled for a while gains are already mostly “cemented” so just stop for at least 3 months. Longer is better.


My MaxVac Setup Longerstretch's Golf Weight and HTW setup My Log

Starting Size: circa 2003: 5 BPEL x 5.0 MSEG August 2007: 6 2/3 BPEL x 5.5 MSEG 04/22/08: 7.5 BPEL x 5.6 MSEG... On and Off again for a while... 11/25/13: 7.75 BPEL x 5.75 MSEG 08/01/19 BPEL 8.03 x 5.6 10/01/19 BPEL 8.19 x 5.6

Originally Posted by sentii
Krupa would you mind saying where you think all those girth gains came from? I see you mention bundled stretches very recently, but I didn’t see mention, at least in this thread, of exercises that aren’t considered length rather than girth exercises. Very exciting to see how tremendous your gains have been.

Hey sentii,

I was recently asked the same question and I have been reading my notes since.

The thing is I have got majority of my girth gains in the first months of this journey. I gained 1.45 cm in first 6 months and 0.5 cm in the next 10 months.
First three months gain was 0.8 cm at the time of “newbie gains” some portion of the gain most certainly being reversing some lost girth during the years.
I did lots of stretching, squeezing and bending, some jelqing and minimal pumping tryouts and only hand full of clamping sets.
Fourth month I gained 0,3 cm girth and at the time I tracked the gains back to manual fulcrum stretching , jelqing being really minimal and no actual girth work at all.

After that girth gains were 0.1- 0.2 cm per month for 3 months despite since having girth orientated weeks in every period with pumping , clamping and jelqing.
After that I was at plateau with girth for months.

There is the thing that we are growing 3 -dimensional volume and looking volumetric development after the first months spurt the gain rate has been steady.
I can only grow penis at certain pace and although the volumetric growth seems slower now it is indicating quite a lot projected three years forward.

I have been recently testing several techniques trying to force some girth gains and I have come to a conclusion that for me is crucial to use stretching practices to produce girth gains. Without bundled and manual fulcrum stretches my pressurized girth manoeuvres are producing only great elastic expansion and no permanent gains. I am gaining again with girth now at least when concentrating on girth work.
I am hopeful on getting some girth development continuing with the length work also taking some manual fulcrums and bundled stretching back to protocol.


START 18/13.15 cm Jul 24th 18 (7.09/5.18") NOW 22.5/15.2 cm Fer 12th 20 (8.86/5.98") GOAL 8.5"/ 6"

When connective tissue is stretched within therapeutic temperatures ranging 102 to 110 F (38.9- 43.3 C), the amount of structural weakening produced by a given amount of tissue elongation varies inversely with the temperature. This is apparently related to the progressive increase in the viscous flow properties of the collagenous tissue when it is heated. (Warren et al (1971,1976)


Last edited by Kyrpa : 12-08-2019 at .

Originally Posted by longerstretch
I base it off my own experiences with low tension high time vacuum hanging after being stalled with manual PE for 2 years, the experiences of others and off this thread…
Loading, lengthening, healing.

This is a way to maximize gains over a lifetime, not necessarily the fastest way to gain. It keeps stress and time needed to create cascade of events leading to gains low. After some time the really low tension of traction and high time will not be enough, estimated at one year. Then you’ll need higher tension but not necessarily high time. Again the use of heat and scheduled decons helps keep the stress (weight or tension) needed for growth low. So a shorter but more intense routine is warranted. I’m currently experimenting for myself if passive ADS in addition to this shorter routine helps with the fibroblast mediated proliferation and my hypothesis is that it does.

What do you think of the idea of doing say “only” two hours a day with an extender but spending half of the extending time heated with US, the other half cooling off, and releasing tension frequently throughout in order to have movement of the tissues. I wonder if that might be equally effective with less time investment and potentially more growth. Alternatively, maybe that would be too similar to your next protocol (the one you currently doing), resulting in too little variety of routine to produce maximum results across career.

Just wondering if this “technology” might be used in earlier stages of PE rather than primarily in later stages, basically. I was hoping for, say, 0.5” gain in length over the next year with this extender. But it would be tremendous to either get that result in half the time or twice the result using more sophisticated know-how /scientific understanding.

Originally Posted by Kyrpa
Hey sentii,

I was recently asked the same question and I have been reading my notes since.

The thing is I have got majority of my girth gains in the first months of this journey. I gained 1.45 cm in first 6 months and 0.5 cm in the next 10 months.
First three months gain was 0.8 cm at the time of “newbie gains” some portion of the gain most certainly being reversing some lost girth during the years.
I did lots of stretching, squeezing and bending, some jelqing and minimal pumping tryouts and only hand full of clamping sets.
Fourth month I gained 0,3 cm girth and at the time I tracked the gains back to manual fulcrum stretching , jelqing being really minimal and no actual girth work at all.

After that girth gains were 0.1- 0.2 cm per month for 3 months despite since having girth orientated weeks in every period with pumping , clamping and jelqing.
After that I was at plateau with girth for months.

There is the thing that we are growing 3 -dimensional volume and looking volumetric development after the first months spurt the gain rate has been steady.
I can only grow penis at certain pace and although the volumetric growth seems slower now it is indicating quite a lot projected three years forward.

I have been recently testing several techniques trying to force some girth gains and I have come to a conclusion that for me is crucial to use stretching practices to produce girth gains. Without bundled and manual fulcrum stretches my pressurized girth manoeuvres are producing only great elastic expansion and no permanent gains. I am gaining again with girth now at least when concentrating on girth work.
I am hopeful on getting some girth development continuing with the length work also taking some manual fulcrums and bundled stretching back to protocol.

Would you say I have it right that the first 1.5cm or so were from standard/traditional PE practices? I guess after those wore out you have found that pumping and bundled+fulcrum stretches work best? Maybe the way to interpret things in the framework of this new methodology and understanding is that you were able to gain well conventionally but to break plateau it has been necessary to combine heated pumping (for quick achievement of elastic limits) with cyclical stretches to capitalize on the benefits of tissue movement to growth? Just curious if that’s what your view isn’t. Unfortunately for me, I have never been able to gain much girth at all with traditional practices.

Senti that could work. Nothing is set in stone these were just recommendations and principles to follow. When I first started hanging many times I had a space heater on directed at my penis but most assuredly wasn’t reaching the temperatures I’m now getting.


My MaxVac Setup Longerstretch's Golf Weight and HTW setup My Log

Starting Size: circa 2003: 5 BPEL x 5.0 MSEG August 2007: 6 2/3 BPEL x 5.5 MSEG 04/22/08: 7.5 BPEL x 5.6 MSEG... On and Off again for a while... 11/25/13: 7.75 BPEL x 5.75 MSEG 08/01/19 BPEL 8.03 x 5.6 10/01/19 BPEL 8.19 x 5.6

Originally Posted by sentii
Would you say I have it right that the first 1.5cm or so were from standard/traditional PE practices? I guess after those wore out you have found that pumping and bundled+fulcrum stretches work best? Maybe the way to interpret things in the framework of this new methodology and understanding is that you were able to gain well conventionally but to break plateau it has been necessary to combine heated pumping (for quick achievement of elastic limits) with cyclical stretches to capitalize on the benefits of tissue movement to growth? Just curious if that’s what your view isn’t. Unfortunately for me, I have never been able to gain much girth at all with traditional practices.

The first part I agree. I see those initial gains being volumetric gains in the realms of tunica elasticity.
Methods used triggered the volumetric growth response .

Breaking the plateau is not fully conquered. The plateau has occurred not because of the stalling of the circumferential tunica elongation but because of the nearly complete lack of it. New techniques are needed to stretch this circumferential layer.

The aim of this present girth campaign was to adopt the concept working with length to serve purposes of girth.
And it has been succeeded partially only. What was lacking was the therapeutic heat. I have not managed to get urethral temperature high enough, up to therapeutic heat (+ 40C) while being under maximal expansion due clamping or pumping. Achieving this is the only way for the gains seen in length work to be reproduced with circumferential stretching. To get permanent residual elongation out of expansion achieved in very effective workouts.

Not managed to do this I still found the way to gain slightly with different way as described in earlier post. The way I would like to gain is still under investigation.


START 18/13.15 cm Jul 24th 18 (7.09/5.18") NOW 22.5/15.2 cm Fer 12th 20 (8.86/5.98") GOAL 8.5"/ 6"

When connective tissue is stretched within therapeutic temperatures ranging 102 to 110 F (38.9- 43.3 C), the amount of structural weakening produced by a given amount of tissue elongation varies inversely with the temperature. This is apparently related to the progressive increase in the viscous flow properties of the collagenous tissue when it is heated. (Warren et al (1971,1976)

Originally Posted by sentii

Just wondering if this “technology” might be used in earlier stages of PE rather than primarily in later stages, basically. I was hoping for, say, 0.5” gain in length over the next year with this extender. But it would be tremendous to either get that result in half the time or twice the result using more sophisticated know-how /scientific understanding.

There are no limitations of who can benefit from the methodology.
Like you described, In the earlier stages to gain safely with accelerated pace, for plateaued veterans to start a new chapter, for hardgainers to get better results and for some to give the opportunity to gain anything in the first place.
At the moment we can not say if there will be non-responders but at the moment most of them on the “program” are initially responding well.


START 18/13.15 cm Jul 24th 18 (7.09/5.18") NOW 22.5/15.2 cm Fer 12th 20 (8.86/5.98") GOAL 8.5"/ 6"

When connective tissue is stretched within therapeutic temperatures ranging 102 to 110 F (38.9- 43.3 C), the amount of structural weakening produced by a given amount of tissue elongation varies inversely with the temperature. This is apparently related to the progressive increase in the viscous flow properties of the collagenous tissue when it is heated. (Warren et al (1971,1976)

I bought a US of national origin. I found it strange that he does not regulate Watts. I can only adjust W / cm² which automatically regulates Watts.

The most important is the power “Watts” or “W / cm²”?

Example:

Setting to w / cm² 0.3 it sets to Watts 2.1

Setting it to w / cm² 0.2 it sets to Watts 1.4


Start:17/04/19:Bp16(6,3)x13,5(5,3)

04/06/20:Bp18,5(7,3)x14(5,5)

Ultrasound Dosing

Originally Posted by freelancer911
I bought a US of national origin. I found it strange that he does not regulate Watts. I can only adjust W / cm² which automatically regulates Watts.

The most important is the power “Watts” or “W / cm²”?

Example:

Setting to w / cm² 0.3 it sets to Watts 2.1

Setting it to w / cm² 0.2 it sets to Watts 1.4

I believe what is important is W/cm^2 (because that is a measure of intensity), and also the frequency MHz setting (maybe a fixed setting). This is what longerstretch recommended for his use:

Originally Posted by longerstretch
3.) Therapeutic Heat: Part B, Heating with Ultrasound
..
Therapeutic ultrasound has been used for decades for physical therapy. It’s using sound waves to heat up tissues deeper into muscle bellies and tendons. There are precautions like you have to keep the transducer moving because it can heat up bone and cause pain, don’t go over spine or other major nerve pathways and no organs other than penis (heart, lung, liver, testicles, prostate, etc). It usually is found in 2 frequencies 1 mHz and 3 mHz.

1 mHz can heat deeper than 2.5-5.0 cm and 3 mHz can heat 0-2.5 cm. Theoretically 3 mHz is ideal but in practical terms both would work just fine. Both heat deep and won’t cause skin burn with other methods of heat. If I apply it to my dorsal side I’ll mainly feel the heat in the center and on other side of penis.

1 mHz option. Delta 1 mHz.
Delta 1 mHz

The 3 mHz option, also the one I currently have. Delta 3 mHz
Delta 3 mHz

The Science of Ultrasound Dosing
I personally keep my settings on 1.6-2.0 w/ cm^2 for 10 to 20 min. I’ve found that to be a safe range and still provide sufficient heating in 5 to 10 min.
..

Read the link that is referenced titled, “Science of Ultrasound Dosing.” It explains in a little more detail. Also it explains Vigorous Heating which is needed to stretch collagen, and the frequency and intensity settings needed to achieve it.


Last edited by Alex2.0 : 12-11-2019 at .

I should note that once again following kyrpa’s lead I’ve started to measure right behind the coronal ridge (proximal), for the purpose of tracking daily strain. I measure right at the base of the ridge. Some days I even take a pen and mark the spot to make measuring easier. I feel like normal BPSFL should be tracked as well, perhaps on off days, or pre routine or weekly.

This way takes out many inaccuracies that can happen when fluid buildup of the glans occurs. I use a vac mod to attach the LG hanger to an X4 Labs extender for half an hour, ratcheting up intensity every 5 min. Then I hang with the LG hanger and finally do manual fulcrum stretches using a Bib hardcore and the power assist . Needless to say with the right intensity fluid buildup does occur and can vary greatly from day to day.


My MaxVac Setup Longerstretch's Golf Weight and HTW setup My Log

Starting Size: circa 2003: 5 BPEL x 5.0 MSEG August 2007: 6 2/3 BPEL x 5.5 MSEG 04/22/08: 7.5 BPEL x 5.6 MSEG... On and Off again for a while... 11/25/13: 7.75 BPEL x 5.75 MSEG 08/01/19 BPEL 8.03 x 5.6 10/01/19 BPEL 8.19 x 5.6

Originally Posted by Kyrpa
The first part I agree. I see those initial gains being volumetric gains in the realms of tunica elasticity.
Methods used triggered the volumetric growth response .

Breaking the plateau is not fully conquered. The plateau has occurred not because of the stalling of the circumferential tunica elongation but because of the nearly complete lack of it. New techniques are needed to stretch this circumferential layer.

The aim of this present girth campaign was to adopt the concept working with length to serve purposes of girth.
And it has been succeeded partially only. What was lacking was the therapeutic heat. I have not managed to get urethral temperature high enough, up to therapeutic heat (+ 40C) while being under maximal expansion due clamping or pumping. Achieving this is the only way for the gains seen in length work to be reproduced with circumferential stretching. To get permanent residual elongation out of expansion achieved in very effective workouts.

Not managed to do this I still found the way to gain slightly with different way as described in earlier post. The way I would like to gain is still under investigation.

I wonder why you gained girth with stretching rather than with radial loading (I.e., pumping/clamping) 🤔 You mentioned that a reason might be that you are able to reach sufficient temperatures while stretching but not while clamped? If so, I wonder why that would be. Why would US not work while clamped? I wonder if water pumping with hot water plus a high temperature heating pad (though you’d obviously have to use a method that doesn’t risk electrocution) would together route adequate thermal energy into the fascia.

Originally Posted by sentii
I wonder why you gained girth with stretching rather than with radial loading (I.e., pumping/clamping) 🤔 You mentioned that a reason might be that you are able to reach sufficient temperatures while stretching but not while clamped? If so, I wonder why that would be. Why would US not work while clamped? I wonder if water pumping with hot water plus a high temperature heating pad (though you’d obviously have to use a method that doesn’t risk electrocution) would together route adequate thermal energy into the fascia.

Blood.Ultrasound does not heat blood. Tissues absorb the energy of the ultrasonic waves and warm up. The absorbed energy is not enough to heat the blood filled unit during 10 -12 minutes clamping set.
The density of the ultrasound absorbing tissue mass is relatively much greater while flaccid and the cooling media such as blood filled cavernous sinusoids not deteriorating the effort.

And I did gain while working with the method but not at the rate I am looking for. I haven´t gained in months in conventional style before this heated round.
All heating can increase the elasticity of the tissues which leads to better expansion during workouts.
But not until the temperature is past the 40 C threshold level long enough during the expansion permanent results are not coming any better.

In conclusion more heating time is needed than the duration of the clamping set allows or/ and much more intense US application than 1.6w/ cm*^2 should be provided.
I did try with two 1.6w /cm^2 transducers having 4cm^2 area per piece. This means I put 7,7 KJ of ultrasonic energy in to shaft during 10 minutes clamping and failed to achieve the therapeutic heat of +40 C.

You said it right more energy should be applied. Any form of pre-heating or/ and co-heating will do. I am going to use some secondary heat source in conjunction with US in the future.
In my case the procedure should include US heated bundled stretching prior and infrared heating pad and US during the clamping. That will be followed with cooling down set in the vacuum cylinder in cyclical fashion.


START 18/13.15 cm Jul 24th 18 (7.09/5.18") NOW 22.5/15.2 cm Fer 12th 20 (8.86/5.98") GOAL 8.5"/ 6"

When connective tissue is stretched within therapeutic temperatures ranging 102 to 110 F (38.9- 43.3 C), the amount of structural weakening produced by a given amount of tissue elongation varies inversely with the temperature. This is apparently related to the progressive increase in the viscous flow properties of the collagenous tissue when it is heated. (Warren et al (1971,1976)

Yes an IR heating pad sounds good for that. I guess you haven’t tried it yet? You seem to favor clamping over pumping whereas I’m the other way around. Not saying that I actually think one is better, I just tend to favor putting peak pressures in skin rather than arteries. My reasoning is that I don’t like discoloration and I’m scared of venous leak. I don’t mind edema, to me it’s just a nuisance, because although it brings additional water volume into the skin, that doesn’t affect the forces your fascia sees because the pressure is commanded by the pump. In other words, edema WOULD drop the vacuum, but it doesn’t because we actively compensate by pumping more to maintain constant vacuum. So edema is irrelevant to me functionally speaking, if that makes sense. Just thought I’d explain that further. Not trying to say that one is better than the other, though as I say the simplicity of pumping with hot water and avoidance of discoloration and vascular stress do appeal to me. This is all theory, of course, I haven’t actually tried this stuff yet.

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