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Using the ultrasound for therapeutic heat in PE

Originally Posted by Sensei891
Gentlhttps://d38a5rkle4vfil.cloudfront.net/image/medium_660/14/1494822227.jpgemen,

First of all I want to thank all the contributors on this forum for giving me the tools to push foward with PE.

I’ve been lurking around these forums for quite some time, especially surrounding the threads regarding US as an aid for PE. And I finally decided to create an user and now putting out my first post. Hopefully some of my data would help the process further and for me to receive some guidance on my further process.

My setup for the moment is quite simple. I’m running on 2pcs US2000, analog fishing scale tied to a desk, Pmpro vacuum bell, outdoor thermometer for temp control, Rice sock for stress relax.
The session itself are :Stress relaxation 15 min external heat (1.5kg), US heat 20min (3kg), cold stretch 10 min.

I’ve attached my progress, as there were some issues with copy/paste excel data.

So based on the numbers my strain rate are nowhere near the suggested optimal level on 2.3%? Strain. However I’m ticking in an increase after each session. Total lenght increase are BPFSL +1.5cm and BPEL +1.9cm after 14 sessions with the US assisted PE.

Lessons learned so far:
- invest in a proper vacuum bell for the glans(Ebay copies provides slippages, edema and pain)
- Use more gel than you think is necessary
- Be sure to control temperature
- cold stretch should not be done with vacuum attachment

Upgrades to my existing setup would be the following:
- Thermometer and data logger to provide constant condition updates and historical figures.
- Rebuild vacuum bell to be used with vacuum-press with gauge.
- Digital scale to improve load control

Now to my questions:
- What might be the issue regarding the strain rate? Each US-session last 20 minutes, whereas 12-13 minutes of the session I’m averaging on 41 degrees Celsius. If I’m going over 3.6-3.8 kg there are development of edema just below frenulum so increasing weight is probably not correct for me at this stage. If I’m not mistaken the optimal strain rate are based on data from some of the forum members? Such as Kyrpa, Manko, etc. Would it be wise trying to chase these numbers at all?
- Should I spend more time during stress relaxation? Not showing too much of an alteration in pre-heat vs post stress relaxation.

Thank you all again, and please forgive my English as this is not my native language.

Hello Sensei,
Impressive. Just outstanding progress you have here.

Looking on the gains only there is not much to improve at all. You are producing numbers not easily replicated for many. You can expect the gain rate certainly dampening in near future.
At the moment changing nothing is the way. In the future the gains start to diminish and very soon you need a decon break and the perfection of the technique starting again after it.
For the strain percentage, hope you don´t mind me asking if have you calculated it correctly. Percentage being percentual increase of the pre-exercise measurement?

The stress relaxation stretch duration is rather short for producing the maximal increase.
For the loading you don´t need to worry. In my opinion you don’t should not increase the load in any circumstances. Increasing time on your stress relaxation phase is the way to go.
The description of the phase does not reveal if the you have attachment of the scale to vacuum bell fixed or do you have some sort of elastic band or spring between?


START 18/13.15 cm Jul 24th 18 (7.09/5.18") NOW 22.5/15.2 cm Fer 12th 20 (8.86/5.98") GOAL 8.5"/ 6"

When connective tissue is stretched within therapeutic temperatures ranging 102 to 110 F (38.9- 43.3 C), the amount of structural weakening produced by a given amount of tissue elongation varies inversely with the temperature. This is apparently related to the progressive increase in the viscous flow properties of the collagenous tissue when it is heated. (Warren et al (1971,1976)

Originally Posted by Kyrpa
Hello Sensei,
Impressive. Just outstanding progress you have here.

Looking on the gains only there is not much to improve at all. You are producing numbers not easily replicated for many. You can expect the gain rate certainly dampening in near future.
At the moment changing nothing is the way. In the future the gains start to diminish and very soon you need a decon break and the perfection of the technique starting again after it.
For the strain percentage, hope you don´t mind me asking if have you calculated it correctly. Percentage being percentual increase of the pre-exercise measurement?

The stress relaxation stretch duration is rather short for producing the maximal increase.
For the loading you don´t need to worry. In my opinion you don’t should not increase the load in any circumstances. Increasing time on your stress relaxation phase is the way to go.
The description of the phase does not reveal if the you have attachment of the scale to vacuum bell fixed or do you have some sort of elastic band or spring between?

Kiitos paljon, Kyrpa!

Its worth mentioning the first week gave me the biggest increase. Remaining weeks gave me approx 1mm pr 3 days.

Strain percentage are calculated post stress relaxation and end of session (post cold stretch)

Sorry for this, I should be a bit more descriptive going forward. The vacuum bell are fixed to the scale which are secured by rope to a desk. So you could call it a static system.

Your feedback is much appreciated!

Cheers

Originally Posted by Sensei891
Kiitos paljon, Kyrpa!

Its worth mentioning the first week gave me the biggest increase. Remaining weeks gave me approx 1mm pr 3 days.

Strain percentage are calculated post stress relaxation and end of session (post cold stretch)

Sorry for this, I should be a bit more descriptive going forward. The vacuum bell are fixed to the scale which are secured by rope to a desk. So you could call it a static system.

Your feedback is much appreciated!

Cheers

There you see. Your routine is solid.
The gain of 1-2 mm in 3 days +2 days rest is the exact gain rate to aim.


START 18/13.15 cm Jul 24th 18 (7.09/5.18") NOW 22.5/15.2 cm Fer 12th 20 (8.86/5.98") GOAL 8.5"/ 6"

When connective tissue is stretched within therapeutic temperatures ranging 102 to 110 F (38.9- 43.3 C), the amount of structural weakening produced by a given amount of tissue elongation varies inversely with the temperature. This is apparently related to the progressive increase in the viscous flow properties of the collagenous tissue when it is heated. (Warren et al (1971,1976)

Originally Posted by Sensei891
Kiitos paljon, Kyrpa!

Its worth mentioning the first week gave me the biggest increase. Remaining weeks gave me approx 1mm pr 3 days.

Strain percentage are calculated post stress relaxation and end of session (post cold stretch)

Sorry for this, I should be a bit more descriptive going forward. The vacuum bell are fixed to the scale which are secured by rope to a desk. So you could call it a static system.

Your feedback is much appreciated!

Cheers

Sensei891,

Thanks for the feedback. I was curious are you expecting additional gains beyond your 1.9 cm BPEL? ( ~.75” ).

Any one of us who stalled on length after long and tedious multiple year PE regiments would be grateful for an additional guaranteed nearly 1” BPEL gain…

Hi all.
Followed this thread for a while now with great interest. Huge thank you to Kyrpa and others for all of their experimentation. I am trying to follow along but I think the US machine I purchased from EBay may be the issue. Can someone who has had some good results please recommend a good machine. I do feel the heat build and it does become uncomfortable at points but I think the US machine isn’t consistent in heating and may have a fault. Also what are the thoughts on 1MHz vs 3MHz, read various contradicting articles.

Once again, thank you so much, maybe one day I will get some of the gains that some of you have achieved. #peace

Hi djrobins,

I wasn’t expecting any BPEL gains during this first round at all. My expectation for the second round would be a bare minimum for BPEL gains. I believe that it will follow BPFSL gains eventually.

You need to remember that the major part of the BPEL gains came in on the first week of US assisted PE. These numbers will be discarded going forward in my data tracking. They are not reliable for future references nor expectations for newcomers in US.

Cheers

Originally Posted by djrobins
Sensei891,

Thanks for the feedback. I was curious are you expecting additional gains beyond your 1.9 cm BPEL? ( ~.75” ).

Any one of us who stalled on length after long and tedious multiple year PE regiments would be grateful for an additional guaranteed nearly 1” BPEL gain..

Originally Posted by Sensei891
Hi djrobins,

I wasn’t expecting any BPEL gains during this first round at all. My expectation for the second round would be a bare minimum for BPEL gains. I believe that it will follow BPFSL gains eventually.

You need to remember that the major part of the BPEL gains came in on the first week of US assisted PE. These numbers will be discarded going forward in my data tracking. They are not reliable for future references nor expectations for newcomers in US.

Cheers

When is your next measurement?

Hi djrobins,

I usually do measurements on a weekly basis.
The coming weeks I will focus on girth. I have chosen restricted pumping and bundled stretches with US. The reason why I’m going for girth is to see if I react the same way as the other forum members, and get accustomed to the process itself.

I will get back with the specific date when lenght protocol starts up again. But I would assume there will be somewhat of a “decon-break” before that happens.

All in all: I will probably not update the numbers for another 2-4 weeks, but I’ll be around re-reading threads about US and learning from other members experiences.

Cheers

Originally Posted by djrobins
When is your next measurement?

So I am now using my new K-type dual thermocouple thermometer - very useful to start gauging temperatures. I like now how I can now be more precise about everything. I’m following what others found to be good protocol (e.g. started today using PMP head but a bit more force in stress-relax phase - starting 2kg going up to around 2.5kg for 30 mins using my own contraption rather than the PMP extender apparatus itself, followed by US 1 MHz 1.6+ W/cm2 for between 12-14 mins with force 3kg to maybe 3.3kg, then 10 mins hard manual pull in all directions and over fulcrum in different directions). I think I might be on the right track now, as my dick feels really long and elastic when coming out of the US phase and I’m measuring some mm increments. But I’m learning as I go, still trying to tweak my set-up to be as effective as possible - strain is currently 2.2%. A few things that came to mind today that I thought I’d ask to optimise what I’m doing:

1. Previous days I used a rice sock under the shaft, measured temperature between dorsal side and rice sock - temperature was getting up to 44 deg C initially, settling down around 40-42 by the end of 12 mins. Today the rice sock felt too hot on my thigh, maybe I need to just microwave it a bit less next time, but as a result I left it off and just measured at the same points but this time between thigh and shaft… by around 10 mins it was starting to edge over 40 deg C, and at 12 mins it was 40-41 deg C. At this point, I wasn’t sure if the glans was feeling a bit odd, didn’t want a blister, so I came out - glans was all fine, but it got me thinking about the question of what is more important here - the amount of time when using US when it’s over 40 deg C with that 3kg+ stretch, or the post-US stretch after reaching 40 deg C regardless of how long you were stretched at that temperature for? As in, if you finally manage to get to 40-41 deg C, even if only for a couple of mins, and then you go into the hard manual stretches, is that what we’re aiming for? Or rather the more critical part of this process is having that US stretch at 40-41 deg C maintained for longer? Like I say today I pulled out because of concern of the glans, but if I could have kept going with US, perhaps I should continue longer until the point that Kyrpa found the internal temp regulation kicks in (around 15 mins). Next time I think I’m going to keep it there longer at that temperature, but wanted to know thoughts of guys on here… I know people tend to do US for 15-20 mins so I suspect now that it’s time at 40+ deg that is the key…. I had just thought before that it was only important to get it up to that temperature, and when you’ve got there that you get into that heavier stretch….Hope people can see what I mean. Anyway certainly the rice sock makes a big difference in getting to that temperature quicker.

2. Second thing that occurred to me, is how rapidly do we need to get into the 10 min post-US stretch. I’m using the PMP head with lube, and I’m starting to get quicker about the change from US stretch, getting out of that thing, wiping off everything, adding liquid chalk and starting the manual pull. Other days it was maybe 2 mins, today I sped it up and maybe 1 min interchange. What is the experience of others?

Thanks


Start: 6" BPEL x 5" EG (mid)

Current: 7.562" BPEL x 5.56" EG (mid, near glans) x 6.25" EG (base)

Goal: 8.5" BPEL x 6.2" EG (whole shaft)

Originally Posted by waterman888
So I am now using my new K-type dual thermocouple thermometer - very useful to start gauging temperatures. I like now how I can now be more precise about everything. I’m following what others found to be good protocol (e.g. started today using PMP head but a bit more force in stress-relax phase - starting 2kg going up to around 2.5kg for 30 mins using my own contraption rather than the PMP extender apparatus itself, followed by US 1 MHz 1.6+ W/cm2 for between 12-14 mins with force 3kg to maybe 3.3kg, then 10 mins hard manual pull in all directions and over fulcrum in different directions). I think I might be on the right track now, as my dick feels really long and elastic when coming out of the US phase and I’m measuring some mm increments. But I’m learning as I go, still trying to tweak my set-up to be as effective as possible - strain is currently 2.2%. A few things that came to mind today that I thought I’d ask to optimise what I’m doing:

1. Previous days I used a rice sock under the shaft, measured temperature between dorsal side and rice sock - temperature was getting up to 44 deg C initially, settling down around 40-42 by the end of 12 mins. Today the rice sock felt too hot on my thigh, maybe I need to just microwave it a bit less next time, but as a result I left it off and just measured at the same points but this time between thigh and shaft… by around 10 mins it was starting to edge over 40 deg C, and at 12 mins it was 40-41 deg C. At this point, I wasn’t sure if the glans was feeling a bit odd, didn’t want a blister, so I came out - glans was all fine, but it got me thinking about the question of what is more important here - the amount of time when using US when it’s over 40 deg C with that 3kg+ stretch, or the post-US stretch after reaching 40 deg C regardless of how long you were stretched at that temperature for? As in, if you finally manage to get to 40-41 deg C, even if only for a couple of mins, and then you go into the hard manual stretches, is that what we’re aiming for? Or rather the more critical part of this process is having that US stretch at 40-41 deg C maintained for longer? Like I say today I pulled out because of concern of the glans, but if I could have kept going with US, perhaps I should continue longer until the point that Kyrpa found the internal temp regulation kicks in (around 15 mins). Next time I think I’m going to keep it there longer at that temperature, but wanted to know thoughts of guys on here… I know people tend to do US for 15-20 mins so I suspect now that it’s time at 40+ deg that is the key…. I had just thought before that it was only important to get it up to that temperature, and when you’ve got there that you get into that heavier stretch….Hope people can see what I mean. Anyway certainly the rice sock makes a big difference in getting to that temperature quicker.

2. Second thing that occurred to me, is how rapidly do we need to get into the 10 min post-US stretch. I’m using the PMP head with lube, and I’m starting to get quicker about the change from US stretch, getting out of that thing, wiping off everything, adding liquid chalk and starting the manual pull. Other days it was maybe 2 mins, today I sped it up and maybe 1 min interchange. What is the experience of others?

Thanks

1.Impossible to know the optimal time needed under the therapeutic temperature based on anything else than from results.

I have maximized the time under heat, spending 8-12 minutes under therapeutic temperature +40 C.
If all the time is needed or not I don´t have enough data to confirm either way.
I have not seen any data from anyone showing anything else either.

You may need to judge your protocol by the resulting elongation from the exercise not by opinions.
Is there elongation happening for the given time?
More specifically : Is the strain after heated stretch more significant than from the cold pre-stretch alone?

2. Why don´t you go for the first manual pull grabbing the thing with a towel and forget all the hassle around.
Check out the graphs I have posted showing the temperature decay being steep in the first two minutes.


START 18/13.15 cm Jul 24th 18 (7.09/5.18") NOW 22.5/15.2 cm Fer 12th 20 (8.86/5.98") GOAL 8.5"/ 6"

When connective tissue is stretched within therapeutic temperatures ranging 102 to 110 F (38.9- 43.3 C), the amount of structural weakening produced by a given amount of tissue elongation varies inversely with the temperature. This is apparently related to the progressive increase in the viscous flow properties of the collagenous tissue when it is heated. (Warren et al (1971,1976)

Originally Posted by Kyrpa
1.Impossible to know the optimal time needed under the therapeutic temperature based on anything else than from results.

I have maximized the time under heat, spending 8-12 minutes under therapeutic temperature +40 C.
If all the time is needed or not I don´t have enough data to confirm either way.
I have not seen any data from anyone showing anything else either.

You may need to judge your protocol by the resulting elongation from the exercise not by opinions.
Is there elongation happening for the given time?
More specifically : Is the strain after heated stretch more significant than from the cold pre-stretch alone?

2. Why don´t you go for the first manual pull grabbing the thing with a towel and forget all the hassle around.
Check out the graphs I have posted showing the temperature decay being steep in the first two minutes.

Thanks Kyrpa, great to have your feedback. OK I will experiment, like you say the results will speak for themselves - for now I think I’ll try increasing time under US once at 40+ deg C, but also having the rice sock brings this point much quicker so will continue like that. Secondly yes I think you’re right, grabbing with flannel or towel right off is better, I’ll figure it out!


Start: 6" BPEL x 5" EG (mid)

Current: 7.562" BPEL x 5.56" EG (mid, near glans) x 6.25" EG (base)

Goal: 8.5" BPEL x 6.2" EG (whole shaft)

Originally Posted by waterman888
Thanks Kyrpa, great to have your feedback. OK I will experiment, like you say the results will speak for themselves - for now I think I’ll try increasing time under US once at 40+ deg C, but also having the rice sock brings this point much quicker so will continue like that. Secondly yes I think you’re right, grabbing with flannel or towel right off is better, I’ll figure it out!

I think you have all the ingredients covered and with a methodical approach you will be gaining any time soon. Just make it happen,


START 18/13.15 cm Jul 24th 18 (7.09/5.18") NOW 22.5/15.2 cm Fer 12th 20 (8.86/5.98") GOAL 8.5"/ 6"

When connective tissue is stretched within therapeutic temperatures ranging 102 to 110 F (38.9- 43.3 C), the amount of structural weakening produced by a given amount of tissue elongation varies inversely with the temperature. This is apparently related to the progressive increase in the viscous flow properties of the collagenous tissue when it is heated. (Warren et al (1971,1976)

Are there any safety concerns for directing an IR lamp to the same region that is simultaneously undergoing US heat?

Originally Posted by gjw965

Are there any safety concerns for directing an IR lamp to the same region that is simultaneously undergoing US heat?

No one knows.


START 18/13.15 cm Jul 24th 18 (7.09/5.18") NOW 22.5/15.2 cm Fer 12th 20 (8.86/5.98") GOAL 8.5"/ 6"

When connective tissue is stretched within therapeutic temperatures ranging 102 to 110 F (38.9- 43.3 C), the amount of structural weakening produced by a given amount of tissue elongation varies inversely with the temperature. This is apparently related to the progressive increase in the viscous flow properties of the collagenous tissue when it is heated. (Warren et al (1971,1976)

Any thoughts on correcting a curve with US therapy? I curve to the left and have trouble with length gains. I don’t think it is peyronies as I’ve had it as long as I can remember but the left side of my penis feels more thick on the inside, whereas the right side (the longer side) feels more smooth and stretchy. I’m not really sure what this is, so any help is appreciated.

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