Using the ultrasound for therapeutic heat in PE

now I can understand this concept more clearly, thanks brother

There are other sources as well telling the same thing, with the 1 MHz the temperature closest to the transducer is not the hottest.

Here is what the source I borrowed says about the diagram:

ULTRASOUND TECHNOLOGY FOR HYPERTHERMIA
CHRIS J. DIEDERICH† and KULLERVO HYNYNEN‡
†
University of California, San Francisco, CA 94143; and ‡
Brigham and Women’s Hospital
and Harvard Medical School, Boston, MA

“Fig. 1, showing calculated power deposition (assuming attenuation of 5 Np x m
x MHz for ideal plane wave propagation in tissue and simulated examples of the corresponding temperature distributions.”

So it is a theoretical model with an assumed average attenuation coefficient for human soft tissue.
With a homogenous wavefield and homogenous absorbing material in addition to the thermal conductivity of the tissue, we get this diagram.
The perfect scenario so to speak.

With an evidence-based attenuation efficient of the non-homogenous tissue, having scattering and reflections when an ultrasonic wave encounters a variation in the acoustic impedance of the mixed medium, we might think we can scale the graph to show more like the 5 cm / 50 % presumption.
The picture narrowing a bit but the meat being the same.

I would like to suggest you start measuring temperatures instead of focusing on deeply engaged theory mixed with feel-based monitoring of the events.
The marriage of the highly theoretical approach without measurable variables does not justify the use of the former.

The exact biggest problem and the most misleading factor of all theories in PE put into practice is showcased right here.

I have been accused of gatekeeping the ultrasound applications, but nevertheless, as long as I am involved in the development of the scene, we will use only measurable variables.

I encourage you to step in for being a guy with a deeper understanding of the subject already and take a chance of keeping a log of your own.
Then mixing the understanding of the theories with the measurable data would be a pleasure.

I tried the protocol OTL again but still can’t generate the amount of heat I do when I am in the extender and use my fingers on the opposite side of my dick.

I have not been doing a good job logging each session. 3 days on 2 off isn’t easy for me to juggle right now. I have approximately 10 sessions under my belt.

I usually can cold stretch to 7.5” and about 7.75” +/- after a 3 min stretch.

I did stretch out to 8” after the US protocol last night but I really dug the ruler in and nearly ripped my dick off.

Time will tell. I am going to stick with the extender. I can easily hit and maintain 40+ degrees and can feel the heat on my septum.
I feel it melting.

Another US protocol session using my extender.
The temps are great but maybe the waves are not reflecting back into my Dick to sufficiently heat my septum. I really struggle with the phantoms. I know Rocco has found good success with them. I am trying to use more of my palm as a backer as opposed to my fingers.

The ruler i tugged an 8 BPFSL is much narrower than my usual and hit a deeper recessed pocket of my pubic bone.

I have to chalk up that I have not made any BPFSL gains in about 11 sessions of the US protocol. However, others are making so very substantial gains.

I am not giving up but I am super frustrated.

Please help me troubleshoot.

So what is your theorie about the fact that the sounds stops when the device touches my skin?

When I work with the device on my body in the low and medium level, the sound that it makes does not disappear, when it touches my skin.
But in the high intensity mode it does. Why is that?

Or is that maybe normal and not a sign that the device is not working. Maybe your US is doing the same I don‘t know..

(I am using lube for sure)

So when I do a hanging session, I lay my dick over a deo spray bottle, made out of metal. When I do that my dick gets wider that way so the Us has more space to work on. Can the metal of the deo bottle reflect the waves back into my dick towards the Us Pro Transducer, or do I need another kind of reflection material?

And how important is something underneath my dick to reflect the waves back inside? If they don‘t reflect back, is the ultrasound method not as effective anymore, because some energy and heat is lost?

The US pro is giving additional BPFSL over other heating methods. I stretched out .25” longer than I have in many years after one week of 2 sessions per day. After 3 weeks it was nearly .50” longer, the BPEL appeared to be somewhat longer ( not .50”, closer to .25”, but i didn’t measure). I have not done it in some time being the process requires your full attention and i haven’t scheduled it recently.

You have understood wrong. You do not want waves reflecting back. It diminishes heating. You want waves to be absorbed when they exit shaft.

Amazing!!! I appreciate the feedback. It is encouraging and I will not give up.

The only thing I can think to try is adding a bracket, to my extender, to hold a phantom gel pad securely and and firmly against my dorsal side, with US gel in between.

I even tried 2 different probes, both are the US Pro 2000 2nd edition.

Not sure what else to try. I am heating up very well with the probe on the ventral(bottom) side and measuring temp from 2 locations on the dorsal (top) side. Easily hitting into the 40’s and maintaining it throughout the session.

Only thing I can think of is that I am not getting sufficient rebounding of the waves and heat into my dick when I only use my fingers. Fingers aren’t the best backer as I am sure I am hitting air as well. I feel pain in my finger tips at times. Perhaps I am hitting bone and maybe the bone doesn’t reflect the waves back into my dock.

I am confused by the post below

Heating problems with extender users

“Using 1MHz application there is 60% of the intensity still left to reflect at certain percentage.
The out border at the surface of the skin does not absorb that still left intensity and certain amount of the intensity not reflected survives to been instantly attenuated exposed in the air.”

We do want to use flesh or a phantom on the dorsal (back) side of the dick, with US gel in between these items.

Is the 60% energy simply absorbed by the flesh/phantom or will the use of the flesh/phantom help reflect the 60% energy back into the dorsal side where the septum lies???

If you read the same post you quoted forward you can find the direct opposite reflection is not desired effect.

It can have a significant counter effect on the source intensity absorbed in the tissue.
The opposite reflecting counter wave from the skin to air boundary is what we need to avoid.

Therefore the heating against the flesh on our limb provides a better temperature reading compared to the extender heating shaft exposed to the air. We want the wavefront to travel through the shaft continuing inside the backing media. Being it then flesh, a phantom made of silicone rubber, or various formats of ultrasound pads.

Using a phantom there will be a reflection at the phantom to air boundary but at that point more of the source wave energy has been absorbed, or refracted, no longer interfering with the source wavefront intensity.
The media should have similar to the shaft acoustic properties, for the wavefront traveling through with as fewer losses or reflection possible.

The pain you are feeling in your fingers is exactly because of reflection, the wavefront reflecting from the bone and heating the surrounding tissue with high intensity.
It was the first hint for me also that the shaft also heats better if there is continuity of the wavefront at the opposite side. We need to remember that I started with the extender set up and struggled to heat the shaft properly, placing the shaft against the leg was a success from the get-go.

PS: There can still be use for the reflectors as such, but then the transducer itself needs to be in angle to the shaft so the reflection does refract at the opposite side skin to reflector boundary. In fact, it is a case that needs to be sorted out.

Hi Stix,

maybe a few words from my side.

1. please make sure that you get a reliable measuring method. The 3 % strain should not result from the different measuring method. Determine once how you measure and then stick to it. Kyrpä recommended it somewhere, if I remember correctly and I measure the same way: Set a fixed point on your pubic bone and from there you always measure BPFSL with a similar force. No matter if PRE or POST. There is no point in lying to yourself or sugarcoating things.

2. please use the metric system. It has been discussed and recommended many times. It is simpler and more accurate. Example: igigi - Using the ultrasound for therapeutic heat in PE

3. why don’t you use the Excel template I created to improve your documentation? I think it is almost impossible to make it easier, because the file even calculates the strain for you.
Rocco25 - Using the ultrasound for therapeutic heat in PE
You should know it, after all you replied to the post where I uploaded it.

4. I’m not sure I fully understood your problem, but I’ll try to answer it as if I did. It doesn’t matter phantom or flesh, the goal of the “object” on the dorsal side is the continuity of the sound waves. When the sound waves hit air on the top of the shaft (in our case dorsal), they reflect, which is not what we want. Standing waves can occur and these do not serve our purpose. Plus, it hurts like hell. We want the waves to travel more or less unimpeded so that good heating of the target area (septum) is possible. Some use the thigh for this, others a phantom, whatever that may look like. Technically, it doesn’t matter whether thigh or phantom, the sound waves should travel further. In the post you linked to, there is a graphic attached that illustrates this perfectly: reflections.JPG

Now two possible problems come to my mind:
A. Your coupling does not fit
Now when you say you can’t get along with a phantom and the thigh, I rather suspect that something is wrong with your coupling between ventral side and transducer. I have found that the coupling also has a big influence on the result. Are you using enough gel? By the way, the coupling to the phantom is of course also important! The whole thing should not cause any pain. Do you expect it to grow only in pain? Then you are wrong. If your temperatures fit, then it may be problem B.

B. Your loads do not fit.
I don’t know your protocol in detail, but it should be known by now how to determine the sweet spot. Meanwhile, Kyrpä has even developed a “formula” to calculate it and the result is certainly not 42. Just incredibly ingenious, this fellow! If you haven’t looked at it, you can find the Excel sheet here:
Kyrpa - The characteristics of the tunica albuginea revisited
It is best to read the whole thread. In short: With the calculated value you can tune your loads.
Just an example: Let’s assume that the beginning of the elastic range would be 2.5 kg in your case. Then you would perform your SR (phase 1) up to approx. 2 … 2.2 kg. The US phase (phase 2) then at 2.8 … 3 kg and cooling (phase 3) at 3.4 … 3.6 kg.

Kyrpä, please correct me if I write BS. But at least that’s how I understood it.

Thank you for clearing this up for me.
I understand better now.

I am still confused why I get better temperature readings with my extender and fingers.

I struggled and could not reach 40 degrees OTL or with the extender and phantom. I am going to try both methods again and rig up a mounting structure which will hold a phantom and mount to my extender.

Thanks Rocco, I appreciate all the feedback.

Are you still using an extender and the US phantoms you molded? Do you simply rest the phantom on your dorsal, extend straight out and US from the ventral side?

I will create a holder for my phantom which attaches to my extender. I think this will help me with the juggling act.

Should I be pressing firmly with the transducer probe? I feel it gives the best results when I press firmly with the transducer probe and with my fingers on the dorsal side.

Responding to your points for further feedback and assistance:

1+2) I have purchased a few metric rulers and noticed that one is not as wide as my English ruler and it fix into a deeper crevice of my pubic bone. I will try some of the other metric rulers which are of similar width to my English ruler. Agreed, metric is a better system and more efficient for our use.

3) I intended to use the template. I have been super busy lately. Work is intense and a shit ton of things have gone wrong in my personal life over the last few months. I have been tackling life items one at a time.
I really have nothing to input into the excel until I further troubleshoot. They had been no change for me. However, there will be and I will keep at it and when I figure it out, I will stand tracking in the excel.

4A) I remember you saying the pain went away when you started to use the phantom. Yes, I do feel some painful spikes but I suppose pain is my friend in other hobbies I practice. Understood, I should not feel pain.
I do wait for the transducer to go through the warm up period before I start.

I shave my unit and my thigh. I use a good amount of gel in between my dorsal side and thigh (OTL) and a decent amount of gel between my dorsal and phantom. I’m still got getting good temperature readings on the dorsal side.

4B) Yes, I have been meaning to check out this excel.
I will. In the meantime, I have been using my extender without springs for stress relaxation. I start at 1.5 kg. When the load decreases I increase the strain distance and re-establish 1.5 kg. I stay at 1.5 kg for 5-10 mins and then increase to 2kg for 5-10 mins. I then jump to 3 and sometime 3.5 kg. I spend 30 mins under the IR lamp.

I then stay at 3.5 kg for the 20 min US portion with no IR lamp.

I then stay at 3.5 kg for the 10 minutes of cool down.

The last couple of sessions I went up to 5.5 kg for the US and cool down portions. I know this is the wrong direction.

My flaccid dick is around 5.75” BPFL and 4.5” MSFG and 5+ BFG.

7” BPEL, 5” MEG, 5.5” BEG

Thanks Again Fellas

Please see my 2 posts above and kindly advise.

I did a 3rd consecutive night of the US protocol.

-OTL with a ton of US gel between the dorsal side of my dick and thigh

-I use a thermometer with two “K” probes. I have been using the clear gorilla tape which Igigi recommended. I was tapping on a way which covered too much septum. I now angle the probes perpendicular to the septum. They did come lose and off. Any more tips on better securing the probes. Rubber bands or 3M micropore tape (I use it on my glans while in the vacuum cup chamber).

-I finally hit temps in the 40’s but it was very difficult to maintain. I was mainly at 39 after a good 15+ mins of warmup.

-I tried two transducers. I think it worked but the temperature probes where not well attached at this point in the session. I may try to get a larger amperage plug in transformer and connect them to the same power source but not yet

-I hung with a basket of weights and a pulley
1.5 kg for the warmup and scaled to 2.5, total of 30 mins under IR lamp. Then 3.5kg with US and no IR. I did not use the digital load cell as I didn’t want distractions for the US. I also did not clamp down the wire just I from of the pulley, as such, the session was creep as opposed to stress Relaxation. I tired the clamp before, I suppose it is a fine line of the clamp just slightly away from the pulley and not touching it. If the details of using the clamp can be explained in more detail it would be helpful

-I reached up to 42 degrees a few times and with no pain. At 42, in the extender, I had tolerable pin but certainly pain

-I stuck with the ruler I always use. I measured 7-5/8” (7.625”) without any stretching or warmup. I stretched to 7-7/8” after the entire session, a 1/4” increase. I am not excited because I can achieve the same results with 3 mins of manual stretching/piss pulls

-however, to understand stain the math, my strain % increase is (0.25”/7.625”) x 100 = 3.28%. I also pulled the shit out of my Dick for the measurement

-I will keep at it and look forward to more feedback so I get it right

-bottom line, I can’t say US is working until I can easily pull my flaccid to 8”

Thanks Again All